ronit wrote:This is not gamethrowing, the town members who are converted to vampires are not going against their new goal.
My opinion: This is the broken mechanics of vampires.
chitownmvp01 wrote:Ironit wrote:This is not gamethrowing, the town members who are converted to vampires are not going against their new goal.
My opinion: This is the broken mechanics of vampires.
Allowing themselves to get bitten goes against the townie's goals though. I do agree with you on this being a grey area.
Emilie9263 wrote:Hi!
Something just happened in a game. I reported it and I wonder if I was right. To me it was obvious gamethrowing, but some of the players believed it was not so...
There was 3 players left. 2 townies and a vampire. Who was who was perfectly known by all. Both of the townies decided to let the vampire bite them instead of lynching him. They said it was alright and they could all win this way. But it's not! I mean the townies played better than the vamp since they ended 2 against 1. I was a town member, I was a bg and I killed the mafioso. Did I not deserve the win like town? I was so mad! It's like when town let mafia win.
Naru2008 wrote:"Role conditions" are the conditions you are given at the start of the game with your role card. You follow them. Nothing else.
James2 wrote:Naru2008 wrote:"Role conditions" are the conditions you are given at the start of the game with your role card. You follow them. Nothing else.
So then the goal has been arbitrarily defined as "win in X way", rather than simply to win. This is the problem with establishing a goal that is not equivalent to the win condition.
And if it's a team game then you shouldn't be able to leave your team.
birdyluv0 wrote:James2 wrote:Naru2008 wrote:"Role conditions" are the conditions you are given at the start of the game with your role card. You follow them. Nothing else.
So then the goal has been arbitrarily defined as "win in X way", rather than simply to win. This is the problem with establishing a goal that is not equivalent to the win condition.
And if it's a team game then you shouldn't be able to leave your team.
It's all about deception. There is a reason that vampires can't bite mafia members; everyone would know. For example, if you had a confirmed spy, and they were bitten by a vampire, it adds a whole new layer of deception because people may think that they are still the spy.
Kbooze wrote:This IS gamethrowing. I don't get what people are misunderstanding here.
Let's say there are 2 town and the GF left.
---SNIP---
Sure the situation is "different", but not really. The one townie ruined their earned win by siding with the mafia, ergo not completing their wincon, and gamethrowing.
What's the difference with the OP's story? Well, I'd say it's even worse when they do what THEY did. They are saying "screw this ship it's sinking, I think I'll board this neutral ship". Mutiny.
The captain AND crew go with the ship.
Now if you are fairly STOLEN from your own ship, then yes. by all means complete your new wincon and don't feel bad about it. But don't just go and abandon your ship because it's sinking.
That's my take on it. /endrant/
Hypothetical Situation 2
There's two investigators, a medium, a revealed Mayor & two vamps. You are the revealed Mayor. Everyone knows who is who and the Vampires are just minutes away from losing. However, at the beginning of the day, one of the vampires publicly announces that they're going to bite you if you lynch one of them. What do you do? Do you essentially 'gamethrow' and vote for one of your own or turn into a Vamp and lose because of it?
Kbooze wrote:This IS gamethrowing. I don't get what people are misunderstanding here.
Let's say there are 2 town and the GF left.
Town 1: Hey GF, I know who you are. I don't like ____ on my team so I'm going to let you win.
Town 2: Wait what??? How is that fair?!
Godfather: Thanks bro, that's really cool.
Town 1: Don't mention it. I like Mafia more anyways.
**Voting phase starts**
Godfather votes for Town 2
Town 2 votes for Godfather
Town 1 doesn't vote
**Night**
GF kills Town 2 / Dead chat is raging their heads off
**Next day**
Godfather: Thanks again man.
Town 1: Don't mention it.
**No one votes**
**Night**
Godfather kills Town 1
**Next Day**
**Mafia wins!**
Sure the situation is "different", but not really. The one townie ruined their earned win by siding with the mafia, ergo not completing their wincon, and gamethrowing.
What's the difference with the OP's story? Well, I'd say it's even worse when they do what THEY did. They are saying "screw this ship it's sinking, I think I'll board this neutral ship". Mutiny.
The captain AND crew go with the ship.
Now if you are fairly STOLEN from your own ship, then yes. by all means complete your new wincon and don't feel bad about it. But don't just go and abandon your ship because it's sinking.
That's my take on it. /endrant/
Ansem555 wrote:I really don't understand why we're still going with this, Devs, Admins and Mods have already said there is no gray area and Town can't go out of their way to become Vampires because that's game throwing against the other Town players. Arguing the "logic" will get nobody anywhere fast, change nothing, and you will be reported for it. Easy to follow.
Emilie9263 wrote:Hi!
Something just happened in a game. I reported it and I wonder if I was right. To me it was obvious gamethrowing, but some of the players believed it was not so...
There was 3 players left. 2 townies and a vampire. Who was who was perfectly known by all. Both of the townies decided to let the vampire bite them instead of lynching him. They said it was alright and they could all win this way. But it's not! I mean the townies played better than the vamp since they ended 2 against 1. I was a town member, I was a bg and I killed the mafioso. Did I not deserve the win like town? I was so mad! It's like when town let mafia win.
testaccount1234 wrote:Outcomes:
1. Townie 1 wants to win with Town, Townie 2 wants to win with Town = Vampire gets lynched, town wins.
2. Townie 1 wants to win with Town, Townie 2 wants to win with Vampire = Townie 1 gets lynched, Townie 2 & Vampire wins.
3. Townie 1 wants to win with Vampire, Townie 2 wants to win with Town = Townie 2 gets lynched, Townie 1 & Vampires wins.
4. Townie 1 wants to win with Vampire, Townie 2 wants to win with Vampire = No-one gets lynched, Both townies & Vampire wins.
Ansem555 wrote:Devs, Admins and Mods have already said there is no gray area and Town can't go out of their way to become Vampires because that's game throwing against the other Town players.
testaccount1234 wrote:Hypothetical Situation 2
There's two investigators, a medium, a revealed Mayor & two vamps. You are the revealed Mayor. Everyone knows who is who and the Vampires are just minutes away from losing. However, at the beginning of the day, one of the vampires publicly announces that they're going to bite you if you lynch one of them. What do you do? Do you essentially 'gamethrow' and vote for one of your own or turn into a Vamp and lose because of it?
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