HereThereEverywhere wrote:This is a role that just devastates claimspace, which is bad. Just pick the first two dead people, and then pick the third role you want to know whether it's in the game or not. If it says two roles are in the game, the person claiming the third cannot be their role, because the dead people are confirmed as the two this role announces.
Jimmy the Lookout and Francis the Bodyguard die. Carl claims Escort. You use your ability to see if there are any Lookouts, Bodyguards, and Escorts in the game. "Two of these roles are in the game!" Presto, Carl is confirmed to be lying. You already know two of them are in the game, the dead Bodyguard and Lookout. But that means there is no Escort, Carl can't be telling the truth. Evils can claim to be this role but it's just a matter of being right, if someone claims this role and is actively calling out evils they're most likely Town. It doesn't work well with dead people, true, but not everyone is going to be claiming the role of a dead person.
HereThereEverywhere wrote:You call it incredibly weak and then say the only thing that needs to be changed is the number of roles it can check? That doesn't make it stronger at all, which means it's still far too weak to be a good TI.
HereThereEverywhere wrote:You still only need to check a role like Coven Leader with Coven or Godfather in a Mafia game, then check it with the NK role, then you'll have two roles that are always in the game. Check that with whatever two people are claiming and boom, still too strong.
cupcakeaj2 wrote:U don't have that many smart players in each game.
Exactly, Mystoc. The role is too weak. Forcing it to always check four doesn't make it viable at all. It's situationally strong, which means it's swingy. If scum claim a role that isn't in the game they're going to be lynched, if not they wont. It doesn't matter it if can't self-confirm, all Town needs to do is lynch either the Prophet or the evil role. Then even though the Prophet is not confirmed, it's still a trustworthy Townie until it does something stupid. Saying it can't self-confirm and thus is bad isn't true, less confirmability is better.
If scum claim a role that isn't in the game they're going to be lynched,
HereThereEverywhere wrote:I already said it was only situationally strong. Also, claiming a role that's dead doesn't account for things like having to explain night immunity or Investigators, or even a Lookout seeing you visit. Scum only claiming dead roles is trying to avoid this one role, but there are other TIs to avoid so it would be stupid to always claim dead roles.
Lynching an evil doesn't mean you're confirmed as any role. For Prophet, it makes them look like trusted Town, not confirmed Town. There are evil roles made specifically to fake Investigator. Sheriff is easy to fake. As is Lookout and Tracker if you know what you're doing. Psychic is easy as well. This role is just as hard to confirm as others.
doesn't account for things like having to explain night immunity or Investigators, or even a Lookout seeing you visit.
HereThereEverywhere wrote:Mafia can bus Mafia and SK if the Mafia is being too susp, that makes them look like Sheriff. They don't have to look like Sheriff for the entire game, because they're evil an they obviously wont when they start voting against Town. You can fake Lookout/Tracker when SK attacks the Godfather, have one Mafia member claim Doctor and the other claim Lookout/Tracker. If the Mafia finds SK, they can claim Tracker and use SK as a target to confirm themselves. It would also work with WW/Arso, though WW only works when claiming Tracker.
HereThereEverywhere wrote:All of that applies to Prophet. Prophet only finds NK? That's suspicious. Prophet only kills obvious Mafia? Suspicious. All of that applies to this role as well, it's equally as easy to claim overall, but it's not strong enough to work around that.
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