Episode XI | Rerolled (TrueGent wins!)

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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:44 pm

ladd wrote:I don't see where she talks about guilt. The post is awful and Mel is probably scum, but that is not a scumslip.

And no, I have read like the first 5 pages and skimmed some other stuff.

"you're going to feel like a dumbass"
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby Zero » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:44 pm

SO 2 people replaced 1 person this fast? I am getting a citizen role vibe from that spot. I do not see why people do not like the Citizen. They are the backbone of the votes in games like this.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:45 pm

Kirize is probably scum, the distancing from the mafia kill was scummy, the bit where he wonders if Cham claimed Citizen in particular just looks fake, considering the fact that he thought the kill was strange and Cham was scummy, it's unlikely that he missed the post considering Cham had like four fucking posts with three words each. He implies he scumreads Hark in basically every post from D1, but he talks to him as if he is Town tonally, the "scumslips" are retarded and that's bad logic even for him. I also completely agree with Hip case on him early D1, it doesn't really look like he believed in the questions he was making and was just trying to look Town, most of his questions have no follow up from what I read.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:45 pm

Me and Toro are one and the same.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby Zero » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:47 pm

Wait so you have 2 accounts? than ignore my last message.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:47 pm

ryanyb wrote:
ladd wrote:I don't see where she talks about guilt. The post is awful and Mel is probably scum, but that is not a scumslip.

And no, I have read like the first 5 pages and skimmed some other stuff.

"you're going to feel like a dumbass"

Guilt is something basically only Town can really feel, but "feeling like a dumbass" is very different from feeling guilty about pushing a mislynch. In Town!Mel mind, Alouvre could be Mafia pushing a lynch on a supposed SK, which would make Alouvre feel like a dumbass, but not guilty.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:56 pm

ladd wrote:Kirize is probably scum, the distancing from the mafia kill was scummy, the bit where he wonders if Cham claimed Citizen in particular just looks fake, considering the fact that he thought the kill was strange and Cham was scummy, it's unlikely that he missed the post considering Cham had like four fucking posts with three words each. He implies he scumreads Hark in basically every post from D1, but he talks to him as if he is Town tonally, the "scumslips" are retarded and that's bad logic even for him. I also completely agree with Hip case on him early D1, it doesn't really look like he believed in the questions he was making and was just trying to look Town, most of his questions have no follow up from what I read.

I don't agree with some of this. I forgot that Cham had claimed cit as well and needed to go back and check, so unless you want to scumread me as well with the same reasoning, I don't consider this argument valid.
I don't like trying to read Kirize given that most of the time he just goes around asking tons of questions with little followup or meaning behind them. That being said, I don't necesarilly think that what he was doing in terms of his 'pushes' early game were indicative of anything. I just read through his ISO and yeah he's got a scumlean on Hark but I don't see it as a full fledged belief that he's scum. Yes I see what you're referencing with the implications, but tbh I don't see it as scummy on Kirize's part.
What I do see as scummy, though, is his behavior all through day 2. More than just distancing, the odd "scumslip"s that he's been calling out and not perusing. He's contributing on a very surface level, whereas he's usually an 'in your face' type of player iirc.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby Kirize12 » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:57 pm

When Lex bothers to respond to my post I will push on him, obviously.
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

Strategical balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because there's no reason to use any other strategy

Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

This matters - educate yourself.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:57 pm

ryanyb wrote:So, my read of your slot started here:
MisaTange wrote:
Kirize12 wrote:Hark and Misa, what is your opinion on James right now?


Null. I was about to pursue him further had he not claimed + demanded roles/be James because he didn't do it as scum in CFM18 (a weak argument, but something to pursue d1/start of d2 if no leads).


as I think it did for most people. You should be able to acknowledge that the addition of unnecessary information here is oddly worded at best. Then his need to oddly defend Yau here
MisaTange wrote:I don't see where Kirize is going with this btw

was out of place. Misa then doesn't do anything when Yau is called out for the contradiction in two of yao's posts regarding james. Misa just avoids the topic all-together.

Then there's the weird thing where he claims scum ironically. Honestly I dont know what to make of it. It's just wifom that id rather not deal with.

Instead of trying to make some reasonable post regarding anything from above she says this:
MisaTange wrote:If I get lynched via misunderstandings I'm going to eat my shoe.


So to sum it all up, all of my reads on her were from D1. It was something to start discussion on D2 but obviously that went nowhere seeing as she vanished. I don't really care what your alignment is right now. I'd say that we can start working it out tomorrow but pretty damn sure that im dead tonight, so rip that.

I don't really feel like wasting much time defending Misa, just know that I read their ISO before replacing and I was townreading them, I would have not have replaced in otherwise since I don't really have time to play scum ( esp mafia ) right now. I actually town read the last post, as it felt pretty genuine and it rarely comes from Mafia, I thought their gut read of Kirize was townie as well, plus I liked their tone. I was not completely sure they were Town, but I was pretty sure they were not Mafia.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:00 pm

ladd wrote:
ryanyb wrote:
ladd wrote:I don't see where she talks about guilt. The post is awful and Mel is probably scum, but that is not a scumslip.

And no, I have read like the first 5 pages and skimmed some other stuff.

"you're going to feel like a dumbass"

Guilt is something basically only Town can really feel, but "feeling like a dumbass" is very different from feeling guilty about pushing a mislynch. In Town!Mel mind, Alouvre could be Mafia pushing a lynch on a supposed SK, which would make Alouvre feel like a dumbass, but not guilty.

Maybe it's just me, but I still don't understand this. As scum, I wouldn't feel like a dumb-ass for looking for a SK and getting town instead. It just seems like way too far of a stretch to compensate for the contradiction between her apparent reads and her claim in said post.

P-edit. And I'm not going to argue against Misa now either. It was by no means a solid read.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:00 pm

ryanyb wrote:
ladd wrote:Kirize is probably scum, the distancing from the mafia kill was scummy, the bit where he wonders if Cham claimed Citizen in particular just looks fake, considering the fact that he thought the kill was strange and Cham was scummy, it's unlikely that he missed the post considering Cham had like four fucking posts with three words each. He implies he scumreads Hark in basically every post from D1, but he talks to him as if he is Town tonally, the "scumslips" are retarded and that's bad logic even for him. I also completely agree with Hip case on him early D1, it doesn't really look like he believed in the questions he was making and was just trying to look Town, most of his questions have no follow up from what I read.

I don't agree with some of this. I forgot that Cham had claimed cit as well and needed to go back and check, so unless you want to scumread me as well with the same reasoning, I don't consider this argument valid.
I don't like trying to read Kirize given that most of the time he just goes around asking tons of questions with little followup or meaning behind them. That being said, I don't necesarilly think that what he was doing in terms of his 'pushes' early game were indicative of anything. I just read through his ISO and yeah he's got a scumlean on Hark but I don't see it as a full fledged belief that he's scum. Yes I see what you're referencing with the implications, but tbh I don't see it as scummy on Kirize's part.
What I do see as scummy, though, is his behavior all through day 2. More than just distancing, the odd "scumslip"s that he's been calling out and not perusing. He's contributing on a very surface level, whereas he's usually an 'in your face' type of player iirc.

I am never reading your ISO this game probably, but I am pretty sure you are in a different spot than Kirize. Kirize explicitly said he thought Cham did nothing alignment indicative or a bit scummy and that the kill was odd from Mafia, so when the player he is talking about has wrote like 20 words total with the only relevant ones being the Cit claim, one would think they read that.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:02 pm

I am not arguing Ml's post was good, it was awful, but people are abusing the term "scummslip" this game and it's annoying.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:05 pm

ladd wrote:
ryanyb wrote:
ladd wrote:Kirize is probably scum, the distancing from the mafia kill was scummy, the bit where he wonders if Cham claimed Citizen in particular just looks fake, considering the fact that he thought the kill was strange and Cham was scummy, it's unlikely that he missed the post considering Cham had like four fucking posts with three words each. He implies he scumreads Hark in basically every post from D1, but he talks to him as if he is Town tonally, the "scumslips" are retarded and that's bad logic even for him. I also completely agree with Hip case on him early D1, it doesn't really look like he believed in the questions he was making and was just trying to look Town, most of his questions have no follow up from what I read.

I don't agree with some of this. I forgot that Cham had claimed cit as well and needed to go back and check, so unless you want to scumread me as well with the same reasoning, I don't consider this argument valid.
I don't like trying to read Kirize given that most of the time he just goes around asking tons of questions with little followup or meaning behind them. That being said, I don't necesarilly think that what he was doing in terms of his 'pushes' early game were indicative of anything. I just read through his ISO and yeah he's got a scumlean on Hark but I don't see it as a full fledged belief that he's scum. Yes I see what you're referencing with the implications, but tbh I don't see it as scummy on Kirize's part.
What I do see as scummy, though, is his behavior all through day 2. More than just distancing, the odd "scumslip"s that he's been calling out and not perusing. He's contributing on a very surface level, whereas he's usually an 'in your face' type of player iirc.

I am never reading your ISO this game probably, but I am pretty sure you are in a different spot than Kirize. Kirize explicitly said he thought Cham did nothing alignment indicative or a bit scummy and that the kill was odd from Mafia, so when the player he is talking about has wrote like 20 words total with the only relevant ones being the Cit claim, one would think they read that.

Also read NFM16 Kirize's ISO, especially the posts after D2 start regarding the Mafia kill.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:05 pm

Kirize12 wrote:When Lex bothers to respond to my post I will push on him, obviously.

What about the other 16 players in the game that you can push.

P-edit
"I am never reading your ISO"
Feelsbadman :C

Idr him saying that it was awkward because he was scummy, but 99% I just forgot the post you're referencing. If I care enough ill go find it. Makes sense.

PP-edit:
Yeah, it is annoying, but I think that said post from her was a scumslip. Especially when mixed with this from Mel a few pages later.
Melanora wrote:Alou, I called Hark scum. I won't ask you to explain his actions because that's stupid. I still believe your slot is scum, but it has to do with Hark, not you. You, however, are better at this game than to do the reads you are, but that's not a valid reason to lynch you and give you an accusation that I require a defense for.

I spoke more on this in my wall, but it should be self explanatory that she's contradicting herself by half-redacting her scumread (I honestly dont even know) which would nullify the argument that she believes Scum!Alou thinks Town!Mel is SK.

PPP-edit: no time.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't thnk of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:07 pm

Kirize12 wrote:Opinion on the mafia kill? It seems really odd. Cham didn't really put in too much effort D1 and did. Toning alignment indicative. Hell, I could even see him being scummy.

Kirize12 wrote:Did Cham claim cit?

Also i don't think a Witch would control Lex.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:09 pm

Kirize from NFM16 as scum wrote:Opinion on the mafia kill?

In other words:
Why do you think the mafia targeted the person they did?


Kirize from NFM16 as scum wrote:I can't really get a strong read off of teaser, but he seemed to be fencesitting a lot. Not a lot of pro-town contribution. I have no idea why the mafia targeted him, except maybe for a safe kill. Seems too safe though.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:10 pm

Can you find a game where he is town and quote any questions that he has after the kill.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:11 pm

I am not that dedicated, but I don't remember him doing that stuff in the Town games I played with him.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:15 pm

ladd wrote:I am not that dedicated, but I don't remember him doing that stuff in the Town games I played with him.

I'm not going to consider the use of quoting his meta from a separate scum game valid unless either myself or someone else goes and quotes a town game from him to compare. Looking at one side of the coin is faulty. I'll go check later but im writing an essay right now.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:21 pm

I am torn between just voting Mel or deathtunneling Kirize.

Choices.

What should I do, Alouvre?
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:24 pm

ryanyb wrote:
ladd wrote:I am not that dedicated, but I don't remember him doing that stuff in the Town games I played with him.

I'm not going to consider the use of quoting his meta from a separate scum game valid unless either myself or someone else goes and quotes a town game from him to compare. Looking at one side of the coin is faulty. I'll go check later but im writing an essay right now.


To clarify: The quotes you pulled are uncannily similar and I'm not denying that. You are very smart though, not just in a FM sense but as a person you are clever. I do not know if that was a rare occurrence, or his common reactions to kills on quiet targets, regardless of alignment.
Basically, im scared of you being smart enough to hand pick quotes from other games to support your argument while intentionally withholding anything that says otherwise.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby alouvre » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:24 pm

make your own choices ya peony

having that said kirize hasn't pinged me but since I have nothing better to do I'll do the dirty work and go meta him. bye

oh yeah btw nice essay ryan
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:25 pm

Well, thanks, I guess.

I can guarantee you I am Town though, Alouvre can confirm it,
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ryanyb » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:25 pm

ladd wrote:Well, thanks, I guess.

I can guarantee you I am Town though, Alouvre can confirm it,

Seems legit.
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Re: Episode XI | Day 2 (I can't think of a title)

Postby ladd » Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:27 pm

It is.

I am without a doubt Town and everyone who says otherwise will be deathtunneled tomorrow.
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