Arcanist(Neutral Killing)

Old Role Ideas

Should Arcanist be in Testing Grouds(goal is 40)

I will kill you if this isn't there(YES)
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Decent, but could use edits(leave suggestions below)
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You're the Spawn of Satan for making this(NO)
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Total votes : 22

Arcanist(Neutral Killing)

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 3:56 pm

Well, I had an idea, and wanted to share it.( I have more, but I want to see if this one is liked)AND DON'T STOP READING IF YOU DISAGREE WITH SOMETHING! FINISH READING THEN MAKE SUGGESTIONS! :devil:

Role: Arcanist(Nuetral Killing)

Attributes:

-You can only perform your ability on full moons(Will receive: The full moon has boost the town's magic!

-You are completely immune to Bodyguards.

-The killer will not be affected by your attack.

Abilities:

-Every full moon, kill anyone who has visited a dead person by reawakening their memories, traumatizing them, or decide to kill one person(needed to buff).



Goal: Kill all who would oppose you.

Wins with:

Other Arcanists.

Witches

Survivor
Special Attributes:

-Will win a stalemate against any night immune role(unless attacks are to go through night immunity).
-You are night immune.

-Doctors prevent both your attacks, but BG can't.


Investigative Results:

Investigator:Your target works with dead bodies. They must be a medium, janitor, or arcanist.

Sheriff: Your target is not suspicious.

Consigliere: Your target traumatizes people. They are an arcanist!

Lore:

As a child, he grew up in Salem. He led a normal life, until the night his mother was taken to another's house. Her place was taken by the Serial Killer, who scared the child out of his wits. He held a knife up to him, and laughed maniacally, plotting his next kill. He eventually decided on the boy's mother. Upon discovery, the boy burst into tears, and ran out. The Serial Killer failed to stop him.

He then told the town's Bodyguard about this, who refused to risk his life for a mere woman like his mother. He shoved the child away, going to guard the mayor. He then ran to the doctor, who agreed to help him, but was jailed that night. The distraught child found the transporter, asking him whom he had transported. He pointed to his house and the Serial Killer's. The child ran as fast as he could towards the Serial Killer's house.

Upon arrival, he saw the Serial Killer stabbing, torturing, and other brutal and inhumane things to his mother. He only heard screams of agony, and then a sudden silence. The floorboards creaked. The Serial Killer turned around, covered in blood. He shoved the child to the floor and sliced his stomach. The child screamed in agony, but nobody cared. He straggled home, and made it. He went to the cabinet with cloth and tied it around the wound, passing out soon after. The next morning, the town inspected the dead body of his mother. The boy, with tears, walked outside. Everybody tried to comfort him, especially the doctor and bodyguard. However, he knew their game. The townies weren't worried until it was them. The mayor hogged all the guards for himself, leaving innocent towns people to die. He screamed " I hate you all! I hope you all die!" The Mafia tried recruiting him, but he didn't care. He wanted two things: his mother and revenge against the town. He knew the retriboutinist wouldn't bat an eye to his pleas, vowing only to resurrect the jailor or mayor. Traumatized by this experience, he fled.

He ran into the woods, practicing the arcane arts. Here he met the town's witch, and promised to help destroy the town. Then, years later, the now adult boy and witch viewed the town. Their souls boiled with anger, and they vowed they would stop at nothing to destroy this town.

Spoiler: Visits count to as what Lookout would see.

Achievements:

My Childhood Dream- Win 1 Game(5 coins)
Allies in Dark Arts- Win with another Arcanist(10 coins)
Childhood Friend-Win with a witch(10 coins)
FEEL MY PAIN!!!!-Traumatize.(5 coins)
Zap- Attack someone normally(5 coins)
Porygon Syndrome- Wipe out 5 players in one turn(25 coins)
Doomsday-Kill a Jailor(10 coins)
Idealistic-Be the last man standing(25 coins)
Revenge-Win 5 games(5 coins)
Arcane Master-Win 10 games(10 coins)
The Devil's Wizard-Win 25 games(25 coins)Just don't read this anymore. Don't read any of this. Forget this failure existed.


I hope this role receives a smidgen of love from the one person who likes it(me).
Last edited by ChubbyMooshroom9 on Fri Dec 25, 2015 6:07 pm, edited 28 times in total.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby kookeekwisp » Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:32 pm

edit: how do i delete comments?
Last edited by kookeekwisp on Fri Nov 13, 2015 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Favorite roles: Framer Survivor Trapper VampireHunter Consigliere Mafioso Escort Lookout Mayor Arsonist Disguiser Veteran Bodyguard Plaguebearer Medusa Blackmailer Executioner Doctor Crusader Vigilante Vampire PotionMaster Poisoner Transporter Jester Jailor Consort Ambusher Werewolf SerialKiller Hypnotist CovenLeader Pirate Godfather Sheriff Forger ??? Retributionist Amnesiac Investigator Necromancer Spy GuardianAngel Tracker Psychic HexMaster.

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kookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentence
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:03 pm

Woops! Accidentally deleted during the lore.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ShortcutButton » Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:17 pm

Uh... so it can only kill two roles, Ret and Amne?
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:27 pm

ShortcutButton wrote:Uh... so it can only kill two roles, Ret and Amne?


No. So let's say Player 1 and 2 visit Player 5 on Night 1. Then, Player 3 kills Player 5 that night. Then, on the next full moon, the Arcanist can select Player 5, causing Players 1 and 2 to die, but not Player 3. Player 3 don't care they're dead.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ShortcutButton » Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:39 pm

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
ShortcutButton wrote:Uh... so it can only kill two roles, Ret and Amne?


No. So let's say Player 1 and 2 visit Player 5 on Night 1. Then, Player 3 kills Player 5 that night. Then, on the next full moon, the Arcanist can select Player 5, causing Players 1 and 2 to die, but not Player 3. Player 3 don't care they're dead.

Oh.

Then that... is a cool idea, good job.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Kirize12 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:12 pm

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:-May only exist when a witch is present


Where I stopped reading.

/nosupport
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

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Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:23 pm

Kirize12 wrote:
ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:-May only exist when a witch is present


Where I stopped reading.

/nosupport


Ok. I will change that. NOTE it said "Debatable"
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Totes » Thu Nov 12, 2015 8:12 pm

A few questions sir/madame, if you would pardon me the time:

1) If a player was brutally murdered, would both attackers be immune to the Arcanist?

2) Can Arcanists kill each other?

3) Do they have death notes?

This is a really good idea and a great foundation as a start on the forums. I expect great things.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 8:20 pm

Totes wrote:A few questions sir/madame, if you would pardon me the time:

1) If a player was brutally murdered, would both attackers be immune to the Arcanist?

2) Can Arcanists kill each other?

3) Do they have death notes?

This is a really good idea and a great foundation as a start on the forums. I expect great things.



Ok. I have answers to all of these-

1)So if a player was brutally murdered, the one who appeared first(Blah blah was brutally murdered. He was stabbed by a Serial Killer. He was also shot by a Veteran) would be immune to the attack.

2)I don't think they will be able to-I mean, they can only visit dead bodies and kill previous visitors. I'd have to assume no.

3)As with any other killing role, Yes.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Totes » Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:19 pm

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
Totes wrote:A few questions sir/madame, if you would pardon me the time:

1) If a player was brutally murdered, would both attackers be immune to the Arcanist?

2) Can Arcanists kill each other?

3) Do they have death notes?

This is a really good idea and a great foundation as a start on the forums. I expect great things.



Ok. I have answers to all of these-

1)So if a player was brutally murdered, the one who appeared first(Blah blah was brutally murdered. He was stabbed by a Serial Killer. He was also shot by a Veteran) would be immune to the attack.

2)I don't think they will be able to-I mean, they can only visit dead bodies and kill previous visitors. I'd have to assume no.

3)As with any other killing role, Yes.

Thank you for the information.

Final Verdict: /support
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Tzedrik » Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:50 pm

This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby oliy » Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:19 am

This is mainly targeted at the Mafia, because you're the NK, and the Mafia is the one killing. Maybe you could target town, but that won't be for N2.

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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:51 am

Tzedrik wrote:This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).


But it isn't night immune(attempt to nerf), so the vigilante could just shoot it anyways. However, I do see what you mean about being helpless against killing roles. But, if a doctor healed the target on the night of the attack, but then that target dies later to the same person, the killer will die. I don't know. I can't think of a solution for that that wouldn't be OP. And about what you said, read the response to Shortcut Button.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:00 am

oliy wrote:This is mainly targeted at the Mafia, because you're the NK, and the Mafia is the one killing. Maybe you could target town, but that won't be for N2.


I no comprehend. Like a "You decide to kill ____ with your own hands." type of thing?
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Totes » Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:14 am

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
Tzedrik wrote:This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).


But it isn't night immune(attempt to nerf), so the vigilante could just shoot it anyways. However, I do see what you mean about being helpless against killing roles. But, if a doctor healed the target on the night of the attack, but then that target dies later to the same person, the killer will die. I don't know. I can't think of a solution for that that wouldn't be OP. And about what you said, read the response to Shortcut Button.

Ooh I got one:

How about you can also visit someone who is alive, and if that person died that night, then everyone who visited that person dies as well, including the killer.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby TimesNewRoman » Fri Nov 13, 2015 10:17 am

The fact that it has no direct killing ability, not to mention the fact that it can't kill other killing roles, means this one is a no go for me. It's just an indirect, weakened Werewolf. Don't forget, the main purpose for the Neutral Killing role's existence is to counterbalance the mafia and give them competition: If you can't kill the killer, you can't combat the mafia. If you can kill the killer, then you can take out the entire mafia by night six.

Final rating: -2
Favorite roles: Consigliere, Arsonist (You read that right)
Least Favorite role: Survivor
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+3: Excellent!
+2: Needs Balancing,
+1: Expand it more.

-1: Needs lots of balancing
-2: Needs severe work.
-3: Abandon or severely rewrite.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 11:26 am

Totes wrote:
ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
Tzedrik wrote:This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).


But it isn't night immune(attempt to nerf), so the vigilante could just shoot it anyways. However, I do see what you mean about being helpless against killing roles. But, if a doctor healed the target on the night of the attack, but then that target dies later to the same person, the killer will die. I don't know. I can't think of a solution for that that wouldn't be OP. And about what you said, read the response to Shortcut Button.

Ooh I got one:

How about you can also visit someone who is alive, and if that person died that night, then everyone who visited that person dies as well, including the killer.



I like this idea, but Times New Roman is right. It does need to kill directly, but I really do like this idea. I just think eliminating a mafia every two nights is a bit overpowered.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby lucas8411 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 1:19 pm

I think this a good Original role, (on some reason "Jesters guys" make a good role) I really thought that this was my "Soldier" role
(Link: viewtopic.php?f=27&t=32067) but I see it's different.
And I see you balenced with the no night immune thing. So it's not a bad role.

Totes wrote:
ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
Tzedrik wrote:This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).


But it isn't night immune(attempt to nerf), so the vigilante could just shoot it anyways. However, I do see what you mean about being helpless against killing roles. But, if a doctor healed the target on the night of the attack, but then that target dies later to the same person, the killer will die. I don't know. I can't think of a solution for that that wouldn't be OP. And about what you said, read the response to Shortcut Button.

Ooh I got one:

How about you can also visit someone who is alive, and if that person died that night, then everyone who visited that person dies as well, including the killer.


Is that not what the werewolf do, but less op?
Last edited by lucas8411 on Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:21 pm

=

Totes wrote:
ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
Tzedrik wrote:This role sounds a bit OP against town roles, especially "investigate" and "protective", since they visit about everyone at least once.
On the other hand, it's useless against most of killing and non-visiting roles.
Some roles would be easy to find. A doused person that dies before the ignition would means a sure death for the Arsonist the next night (unless non-full moon).


But it isn't night immune(attempt to nerf), so the vigilante could just shoot it anyways. However, I do see what you mean about being helpless against killing roles. But, if a doctor healed the target on the night of the attack, but then that target dies later to the same person, the killer will die. I don't know. I can't think of a solution for that that wouldn't be OP. And about what you said, read the response to Shortcut Button.

Ooh I got one:

How about you can also visit someone who is alive, and if that person died that night, then everyone who visited that person dies as well, including the killer.


Is that not what the werewolf do, but less op?[/quote]

Hmmm.. Maybe it can choose whether it would like to get one definitive kill or a risky multiple kills?(One button that is a "attack" that will only kill one person. The other button(only for le deads) could be used to maybe get a handful of kills that night.) Just leave any suggestions you have in the comments.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby oliy » Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:58 pm

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
oliy wrote:This is mainly targeted at the Mafia, because you're the NK, and the Mafia is the one killing. Maybe you could target town, but that won't be for N2.


I no comprehend. Like a "You decide to kill ____ with your own hands." type of thing?

I thought you idd an alert style thing but on previously killed targets.
What good is knowing who visited the dead people are? Also, why can you only kill every so often? Healing doesn't help, and neither does immunity or protection.

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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 7:08 pm

oliy wrote:
ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
oliy wrote:This is mainly targeted at the Mafia, because you're the NK, and the Mafia is the one killing. Maybe you could target town, but that won't be for N2.


I no comprehend. Like a "You decide to kill ____ with your own hands." type of thing?

I thought you idd an alert style thing but on previously killed targets.
What good is knowing who visited the dead people are? Also, why can you only kill every so often? Healing doesn't help, and neither does immunity or protection.



You are right. I just didn't understand what you were saying when you wrote that. It was just really weird English. But no offense to you, your grammar is probably good. You can only kill every full moon(I will change if wanted) is to prevent too many kills too rapidly. However, you can easily wipe out the town if you're lucky. Protection(BG, not doctor) helps, and immunity I don't think it should pierce.(Again, may change if requested enough) And it KILLS all people who have visited that player(obviously is more potent as the game runs).
Last edited by ChubbyMooshroom9 on Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby ChubbyMooshroom9 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 7:21 pm

TimesNewRoman wrote:The fact that it has no direct killing ability, not to mention the fact that it can't kill other killing roles, means this one is a no go for me. It's just an indirect, weakened Werewolf. Don't forget, the main purpose for the Neutral Killing role's existence is to counterbalance the mafia and give them competition: If you can't kill the killer, you can't combat the mafia. If you can kill the killer, then you can take out the entire mafia by night six.

Final rating: -2



Maybe have a percentage chance to kill them? Like, a 25% death chance and a 75% chance of doing nothing(or being role blocked?)
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Totes » Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:15 pm

kookeekwisp wrote:edit: how do i delete comments?

There should be a button with an "X" in it in the top right of your comment, by the quote, edit, and report functions. You click on that and it will delete your comment.
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Re: A Role Idea

Postby Kirize12 » Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:18 pm

ChubbyMooshroom9 wrote:
TimesNewRoman wrote:The fact that it has no direct killing ability, not to mention the fact that it can't kill other killing roles, means this one is a no go for me. It's just an indirect, weakened Werewolf. Don't forget, the main purpose for the Neutral Killing role's existence is to counterbalance the mafia and give them competition: If you can't kill the killer, you can't combat the mafia. If you can kill the killer, then you can take out the entire mafia by night six.

Final rating: -2



Maybe have a percentage chance to kill them? Like, a 25% death chance and a 75% chance of doing nothing(or being role blocked?)


We don't do RNG here.
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

Strategical balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because there's no reason to use any other strategy

Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

This matters - educate yourself.
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