Blackmailer Rework

[OreCreeper]

Alignment:
Mafia Support

Statistics:
Attack: None
Defense: None
Unique: No

Abilities:
- Choose one person each night to blackmail.

Attributes:
- You will receive all feedback notifications your target receives (in red).
- You will know who your target visited.
- You may choose to hide the feedback from your target (through a toggleable option like SK's cautious ability).

Investigative Results:
- No change.

Additional Comments:
- Since many people were complaining that blackmailer's ability to prevent daytime discussion is unhealthy, the purpose of this rework is to prevent that while retaining blackmailer's original purpose. It can still prevent townies from sharing useful info (through hiding their night feedback), but it no longer prevents townies from participating in the daytime discussion.
- In addition, I have removed blackmailer's ability to read whispers because I believe that it's counterintuitive to the role's main ability, which is to prevent people from sharing information. This way, blackmailers would be less likely to be discouraged from using their actually ability in fear of discouraging townies from whispering, which destroys the current blackmailer's main method of gathering info.
- To make up for the loss of the whisper-reading ability, I have given blackmailer the default ability to read the feedback of other players. That way, blackmailers can steal information from TIs just like how the current blackmailer gathers information from TIs sharing their results through whispers. However, this ability no longer affects blackmailer's ability to blackmail, as blackmailers can still gather information from targets they hide feedback from.
- As another benefit, the blackmailer can now reliably claim spy. The main way spies are able to confirm themselves is through accurate bugs. Now, blackmailers also have a "bug" ability, with the additional benefit of stealing role-feedback. This way, spies would be much harder to confirm because they may possibly be a blackmailer.
- For clarifications, the blackmailer may steal someone's feedback without blackmailing them (just like SK can choose not to go on cautious mode).

[Cookazoo2]

Would it also be prudent to include where your target ended up targeting?

"Your target chose to visit (9) John Hathorne last night."

This wouldn't be affected by witches, transports, or roleblocks – it just tells you where they said they'd go.

[OreCreeper]

Would it also be prudent to include where your target ended up targeting?

"Your target chose to visit (9) John Hathorne last night."

This wouldn't be affected by witches, transports, or roleblocks – it just tells you where they said they'd go.

Yeah definitely, I'm gonna add that.

[alex1234321]

I like the idea of reworking Blackmailer and agree that it is a fundamentally broken role. However, this role seems very weak even with the Tracker ability. In most cases I'm not sure why the Mafia would care who someone visits. I'm also not sure when the feedback receiving ability would be useful to the Mafia, and removing feedback should be a function of the Hypnotist imo. However, receiving feedback could be a useful addition to a Mafia Lookout/Tracker role since it gives additional information that could be useful in conjunction with those abilities without being similar to Consigliere.

[OreCreeper]

I like the idea of reworking Blackmailer and agree that it is a fundamentally broken role. However, this role seems very weak even with the Tracker ability. In most cases I'm not sure why the Mafia would care who someone visits. I'm also not sure when the feedback receiving ability would be useful to the Mafia, and removing feedback should be a function of the Hypnotist imo. However, receiving feedback could be a useful addition to a Mafia Lookout/Tracker role since it gives additional information that could be useful in conjunction with those abilities without being similar to Consigliere.

Well you can steal the information of another player, and you can find out what roles are in play. You can use the results of an investigator to find out someone else's role. You can use a spy will to find out if your mafia members were witched or if their target was transed so you can correct your spy will. You can use a lookout to find who the TPs are on jailor. If your target visits someone who is rbed, you know your target is probably the escort. If your target visits someone who claims witched, good chance they're witch, especially if they lie about their actual visit. If your target visits the TP/LO request, they're probably a TP. You can also use your target's info to find out who is jailed so if you're claiming TI, you can put the jailed person in your will to look legit, or you can tell it to another mafia member. There's a lot of uses for this role.

The removing feedback thing for hypnotist should only work on non role-feedback messages and shouldn't notify the player. My blackmailer rework removes all feedback messages and leaves a message as well. So the hypnotist might trick a player into thinking nothing actually happened to them, while this role just prevents them from getting info.

[Kelisidina]

Add 'can't make players do day time things.'

i.e. Mayor able to reveal

[syjfwbaobfwl]

Add 'can't make players do day time things.'

i.e. Mayor able to reveal

No because that would be hard counter to jailor and mayor, and hard counters are bad, also it doesnt makes sense lore wise

[OreCreeper]

Add 'can't make players do day time things.'

i.e. Mayor able to reveal

*Perma-BMs the jailor so they can't jail anyone*

[Dimethyltryptamine99]

Alignment:
Mafia Support

Statistics:
Attack: None
Defense: None
Unique: No

Abilities:
- Choose one person each night to blackmail.

Attributes:
- You will receive all feedback notifications your target receives (in red).
- You will know who your target visited.
- You may choose to hide the feedback from your target (through a toggleable option like SK's cautious ability).

Investigative Results:
- No change.

Additional Comments:
- Since many people were complaining that blackmailer's ability to prevent daytime discussion is unhealthy, the purpose of this rework is to prevent that while retaining blackmailer's original purpose. It can still prevent townies from sharing useful info (through hiding their night feedback), but it no longer prevents townies from participating in the daytime discussion.
- In addition, I have removed blackmailer's ability to read whispers because I believe that it's counterintuitive to the role's main ability, which is to prevent people from sharing information. This way, blackmailers would be less likely to be discouraged from using their actually ability in fear of discouraging townies from whispering, which destroys the current blackmailer's main method of gathering info.
- To make up for the loss of the whisper-reading ability, I have given blackmailer the default ability to read the feedback of other players. That way, blackmailers can steal information from TIs just like how the current blackmailer gathers information from TIs sharing their results through whispers. However, this ability no longer affects blackmailer's ability to blackmail, as blackmailers can still gather information from targets they hide feedback from.
- As another benefit, the blackmailer can now reliably claim spy. The main way spies are able to confirm themselves is through accurate bugs. Now, blackmailers also have a "bug" ability, with the additional benefit of stealing role-feedback. This way, spies would be much harder to confirm because they may possibly be a blackmailer.
- For clarifications, the blackmailer may steal someone's feedback without blackmailing them (just like SK can choose not to go on cautious mode).

Stop trying to change roles that don't need to be changed please.

[CapWarrior2]

Stop trying to change roles that don't need to be changed please.

Blackmailer does definently need a change, although I do somewhat agree in saying that bmer does perform alright (going against bmer or being bmer) but that doesn't mean it can't be changed, or doesn't need to be. In this case I definently argue the opposite because to take away the core function of a social deduction game isnt a good ability at all, it's just a little bit annoying and really unessecary. If a townie Is a threat to the Mafia, silence them in different ways when possible. Also spamming bming on someone is just straight up toxic (Idk why people do that unless it's to take up the LO count on a tp/lo or something).
The OP states this well

Additional Comments:
- Since many people were complaining that blackmailer's ability to prevent daytime discussion is unhealthy, the purpose of this rework is to prevent that while retaining blackmailer's original purpose. It can still prevent townies from sharing useful info (through hiding their night feedback), but it no longer prevents townies from participating in the daytime discussion.
- In addition, I have removed blackmailer's ability to read whispers because I believe that it's counterintuitive to the role's main ability, which is to prevent people from sharing information. This way, blackmailers would be less likely to be discouraged from using their actually ability in fear of discouraging townies from whispering, which destroys the current blackmailer's main method of gathering info.

(To the OP, instead of having bmer seeing visits it might be better having Consigliere see that, but other then that good idea)

[syjfwbaobfwl]

Should I feel bad because I never saw a problem with people spamming votes when bmed?

Everyone complained "they should have to wait before voting again"

But I alwys failed to see why that was a problem, as not being able to share info in any way was enough



Back to the topic

Bmer needs a change, while I agree that silence is just a flawled mechanic, it is more for the reading whisper abiity which is unbalanced and having a randomly spawning role which reads whispers is swingy

[OreCreeper]

Additional Comments:
- Since many people were complaining that blackmailer's ability to prevent daytime discussion is unhealthy, the purpose of this rework is to prevent that while retaining blackmailer's original purpose. It can still prevent townies from sharing useful info (through hiding their night feedback), but it no longer prevents townies from participating in the daytime discussion.
- In addition, I have removed blackmailer's ability to read whispers because I believe that it's counterintuitive to the role's main ability, which is to prevent people from sharing information. This way, blackmailers would be less likely to be discouraged from using their actually ability in fear of discouraging townies from whispering, which destroys the current blackmailer's main method of gathering info.

(To the OP, instead of having bmer seeing visits it might be better having Consigliere see that, but other then that good idea)

I suggested a different buff for the consigliere, which you probably already know about. Also, for clarifications, my rework allows bmer to see who their target visits, not any of their target's visitors. It is mostly used in complement with the feedback stealing though.