Ambusher (Change)

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Ambusher (Change)

Postby Soulshade55r » Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:06 am

-The Ambushers Message when visiting someone is gone.
-Instead replace it with Ambusher getting a message and not being able to kill if more then one person visited the target.

!You saw multiple people Visit your target, you decided to flee the scene.

Why:
-Reduces Kpn
-Reduces Ambusher being more rng.
-Reduces a certain level of swing
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby RiceHatMan » Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:40 am

I see how this could be useful. It's just that this reduces the kill per night by a lot. Chances are, no one is going to visit your target, or more than 1 will. It requires a lot of skill to predict who will be visited once, to the point where it's not much better than guessing.
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Soulshade55r » Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:41 am

Harryyoshi wrote:I see how this could be useful. It's just that this reduces the kill per night by a lot. Chances are, no one is going to visit your target, or more than 1 will. It requires a lot of skill to predict who will be visited once, to the point where it's not much better than guessing.


I think keeping the limited purpose of only getting away with a kill on someone who was visited once is great, I feel like current ambusher gets a lot of rng that screws them over in situations.

This would make Ambusher less likely to kill but be more hidden which is for the better imo
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby cob709 » Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:06 pm

Sounds liek a pretty good change.
Perhaps the visitors should be notified that someone was preparing the Ambush.
You saw an Ambusher run away last night!


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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Brilliand » Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:19 pm

The only reason not to like this change is if you think the Ambusher also shouldn't score a kill if he visits someone who should have multiple visitors but coincidentally doesn't (for example, if he visits the Jailor N1 in a game with only one TP and no Lookout/Escort/Spy). With the current version of the Ambusher, the Ambusher will avoid that situation because odds are he will die; with the Soulshade55r rework, the Ambusher may as well try it, and claim RT Doctor if a Lookout sees him.

That objection doesn't seem very strong to me, so I'm tentatively in favor of this change.
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby syjfwbaobfwl » Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:24 pm

Brilliand wrote:The only reason not to like this change is if you think the Ambusher also shouldn't score a kill if he visits someone who should have multiple visitors but coincidentally doesn't (for example, if he visits the Jailor N1 in a game with only one TP and no Lookout/Escort/Spy). With the current version of the Ambusher, the Ambusher will avoid that situation because odds are he will die; with the Soulshade55r rework, the Ambusher may as well try it, and claim RT Doctor if a Lookout sees him.

That objection doesn't seem very strong to me, so I'm tentatively in favor of this change.


With Soulshade's rework, the LO wouldnt see the ambusher since they would flee from the scene
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Brilliand » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:11 pm

syjfwbaobfwl wrote:With Soulshade's rework, the LO wouldnt see the ambusher since they would flee from the scene


Maybe? That's kind of vague actually.
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Royee » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:15 pm

/support
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby OreCreeper » Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:23 pm

Soulshade55r wrote:-The Ambushers Message when visiting someone is gone.
-Instead replace it with Ambusher getting a message and not being able to kill if more then one person visited the target.

!You saw multiple people Visit your target, you decided to flee the scene.

Why:
-Reduces Kpn
-Reduces Ambusher being more rng.
-Reduces a certain level of swing

I mean this makes ambusher kind of an omniscient killing role. Also, sometimes you want to get that extra kill in to gain majority, so I'd suggest that the person killed doesn't figure out who the ambusher is, but all other visitors do. That way, ambushers who play smart can get away with killing townies easily, but it doesn't go to the point where the ambusher can randomly choose players without any risk. Also it still keeps the usefulness of being able to ambush an important townie to get an extra kill for mafia to gain majority.
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Soulshade55r » Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:24 pm

syjfwbaobfwl wrote:
Brilliand wrote:The only reason not to like this change is if you think the Ambusher also shouldn't score a kill if he visits someone who should have multiple visitors but coincidentally doesn't (for example, if he visits the Jailor N1 in a game with only one TP and no Lookout/Escort/Spy). With the current version of the Ambusher, the Ambusher will avoid that situation because odds are he will die; with the Soulshade55r rework, the Ambusher may as well try it, and claim RT Doctor if a Lookout sees him.

That objection doesn't seem very strong to me, so I'm tentatively in favor of this change.


With Soulshade's rework, the LO wouldnt see the ambusher since they would flee from the scene


Definitely a decent point I could It should be fine moatly and may discoruge jailor meta a bit.

Maybe it would still alert players ambusher was on someone just not instently out them. So it could be easier to deduce who the ambusher is in the LO example.
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby Soulshade55r » Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:29 pm

OreCreeper wrote:
Soulshade55r wrote:-The Ambushers Message when visiting someone is gone.
-Instead replace it with Ambusher getting a message and not being able to kill if more then one person visited the target.

!You saw multiple people Visit your target, you decided to flee the scene.

Why:
-Reduces Kpn
-Reduces Ambusher being more rng.
-Reduces a certain level of swing

I mean this makes ambusher kind of an omniscient killing role. Also, sometimes you want to get that extra kill in to gain majority, so I'd suggest that the person killed doesn't figure out who the ambusher is, but all other visitors do. That way, ambushers who play smart can get away with killing townies easily, but it doesn't go to the point where the ambusher can randomly choose players without any risk. Also it still keeps the usefulness of being able to ambush an important townie to get an extra kill for mafia to gain majority.


I think that's a bad thing it doesn't tale work to ambush a jailor claim who you know is going to be visited to gain majority, I actually like the idea of Ambusher being less outed but also reduce easy spots of kpn on nights evil gain majority.

Ambusher should be about targeting a player whos either a little sus or someone whos a 2nd major townie (aka a mayor, Lo ect)

Making infomes choices is how ambusher should work having a slight reduced kpn to complicate being outed if they do anything slightly risky isn't fun nor balanced to me
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Spoiler: Town: Jailor
Mafia: Consort
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Re: Ambusher (Change)

Postby DiamondRanger8 » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:23 pm

I don't find anything wrong with this change, but I do agree with the idea people will see if an Ambusher runs away. I hope the devs still read Role Ideas so they'll see this. I
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