9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Game Over (Town Wins!)

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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:54 am

ElusiveBelle wrote:
James2 wrote:
Arguing that the town power shouldn't reveal because they could be targeted is like arguing that antibiotics should never be used because it's increase immunity.


That line of thinking completely ignores the arguments other side of the coin, it still leaves everyone else more vulnerable. This line of thought is saying literally everyone but the Town Power is expendable.

The Town Power is the most important role. They should get priority protection after they reveal.

FirelightKnight wrote:Honestly, the town power should only claim if they're completely confident they can lead. And even then, perhaps it's not the greatest idea D1.
If TPow rolls Jailor or Ret, I'd honestly prefer they kept quiet for now. It's their choice, but when the protective dies, which could be N1 or N5 for all we know, they'd be the next target for scum, and I'd rather not rely on a random town being protective. Plus, if Consort rolls it'd be nice for the Ret (if they exist.) to actually be able to revive someone without being constantly roleblocked.

+The stuff ElusiveBelle said.

I get what James is saying, but is it really worth risking it before we need it? A dead town power is completely useless. The same goes for any role in the game, really. We don't need it right now, and chances are we're not going to need it tomorrow, so yeah.
Also.. how does knowing who slept peacefully and who didn't benefit scum at all? Yeah, its more info, but really what are they going to do with it?


Even if the Town Power were to die night two, which is unlikely, they'd still have helped us by pointing out who to look at as scum etc.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:55 am

LordofFail wrote:
James2 wrote:Kirize is so salty.

Anyway, I'm a (redacted).

Seriously though, I'm going to try to play this game without any crazy gambits.



WHO ARE YOU AND WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH JAMES2??


James2 wrote:Getting to business, twenty four hours into day two, we should identify the town power by everyone either affirming being the town power or denying it. If there's only one claimant, then they'll be confirmed without even having to tell their role. Since we have a town power to lead us, we should withhold our night results until we can give them to the town power.

Also, in order to allow differentiability (and thus make it easier for people to confirm themselves), any vigilantes or firebrands should put some large number in their death note for ease of identification. Even if you're not choosing to kill anyone, a witch could still force a kill, so it is imperative that you put a number in your DN. Firebrands need to be sure to do this by the end of night one, vigilantes must do this by the end of night two.



Oh wait, nevermind, hes back to his blissfully tactically impaired self again. Welcome back James, care to hardclaim now?


But since James insists that the Town Power should hardclaim, I may as well reveal...

Spoiler: I am the Not-Mayor!


Don't disclaim yet.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:57 am

And all this stuff about the TPower's competency is besides the point. Obama* is an incompetent fool, but we're still better off with him as President then we would be under anarchy.

*If you're a lib then you can pretend I said Bush.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:58 am

Fire,

As a confirmed town, we can trust the Town Power with our roles and information.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby ElusiveBelle » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:58 am

alouvre wrote:How does that tie into the presence of a exe/jester, specifically?

You mean other than the very blatant targeting of one player in specific?

Kirize likes to play abrasive but coming out of the gates like that before the offending player can even make a post, as others have said, comes off a bit skeptical. It could be Kirize being Kirize, that is a very likely scenario, that doesn't excuse the caution that should be taken regardless until more concrete evidence comes forward

James2 wrote:The Town Power is the most important role. They should get priority protection after they reveal.


This is very true, the Town Power should have priority protection. That is why them revealing so early is a bad thing, it leaves everyone else vulnerable with close to no protection.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby alouvre » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:00 pm

don't play the politics card, my good man

@Elusive: Oh, that. Hm, policy kill questions are always going to be targeting a certain player, but I see what you mean now.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:01 pm

ElusiveBelle wrote:
alouvre wrote:How does that tie into the presence of a exe/jester, specifically?

You mean other than the very blatant targeting of one player in specific?

Kirize likes to play abrasive but coming out of the gates like that before the offending player can even make a post, as others have said, comes off a bit skeptical. It could be Kirize being Kirize, that is a very likely scenario, that doesn't excuse the caution that should be taken regardless until more concrete evidence comes forward

James2 wrote:The Town Power is the most important role. They should get priority protection after they reveal.


This is very true, the Town Power should have priority protection. That is why them revealing so early is a bad thing, it leaves everyone else vulnerable with close to no protection.


They need protection because of their value to town. Their value primarily comes from their leadership abilities, which are null if they don't reveal.

And besides, we do in fact have the means to protect them.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:02 pm

alouvre wrote:don't play the politics card, my good man

@Elusive: Oh, that. Hm, policy kill questions are always going to be targeting a certain player, but I see what you mean now.


This is what I call the "I can't hear you fallacy".

Referencing politics doesn't nullify the point, and it's pertinent because this game involves a type of politics.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:05 pm

Kirize12 wrote:
James2 wrote:And all this stuff about the TPower's competency is besides the point. Obama* is an incompetent fool, but we're still better off with him as President then we would be under anarchy.

*If you're a lib then you can pretend I said Bush.

It is not besides the point. The Town power may be...well, Town Power, but they do not command. If you want the Town Power to call all of the town's shots and not give anyone else a say in the matter, then you're bad and you should feel bad.

:o oshitapageget


Could you answer my earlier question?
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby alouvre » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:08 pm

Non-TPwr town that can also easily confirm themselves:

1. Non-shitty escort
2. Doctor with successful heal
3. Vigilante
4. Non-shitty firebrand
5. Veterab
6. Transporter

every other role can also be proven under circumstantial evidence as well so idk what your point is

James2 wrote:This is what I call the "I can't hear you fallacy".

Referencing politics doesn't nullify the point, and it's pertinent because this game involves a type of politics.

And what if you're an anarchist? Then it's still a matter of opinion.

All in all it just boils down to the tpwr's decision on whether to reveal or not.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby LordofFail » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:11 pm

James2 wrote:And all this stuff about the TPower's competency is besides the point. Obama* is an incompetent fool, but we're still better off with him as President then we would be under anarchy.

*If you're a lib then you can pretend I said Bush.


I am Canadian and do not get your analogy because I dont give two shits about United States politics.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby RockFire » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:12 pm

Alouvre is whispering to TiltedConedian and SirkCakez! They have two whispers remaining.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:12 pm

Kirize12 wrote:
James2 wrote:
ElusiveBelle wrote:You mean other than the very blatant targeting of one player in specific?

Kirize likes to play abrasive but coming out of the gates like that before the offending player can even make a post, as others have said, comes off a bit skeptical. It could be Kirize being Kirize, that is a very likely scenario, that doesn't excuse the caution that should be taken regardless until more concrete evidence comes forward

This is very true, the Town Power should have priority protection. That is why them revealing so early is a bad thing, it leaves everyone else vulnerable with close to no protection.


They need protection because of their value to town. Their value primarily comes from their leadership abilities, which are null if they don't reveal.

And besides, we do in fact have the means to protect them.

Town Power =/= leadership ability. They may be the leader, but if they're incompetent we will not let them lead.

Honestly, I'm done arguing with you over this. If you wanna blindly follow the Town Power, kindly follow him into a Veteran and save us the trouble of having to deal with your bullshit.


Given that the town is 40% evil, it's not qualified to judge the competence of a confirmed town member. Scum will declare any leader incompetent.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby Tiltedcomedian » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:13 pm

alouvre is Town.

I think.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:13 pm

alouvre wrote:Non-TPwr town that can also easily confirm themselves:

1. Non-shitty escort
2. Doctor with successful heal
3. Vigilante
4. Non-shitty firebrand
5. Veterab
6. Transporter

every other role can also be proven under circumstantial evidence as well so idk what your point is

James2 wrote:This is what I call the "I can't hear you fallacy".

Referencing politics doesn't nullify the point, and it's pertinent because this game involves a type of politics.

And what if you're an anarchist? Then it's still a matter of opinion.

All in all it just boils down to the tpwr's decision on whether to reveal or not.


If they can absolutely confirm themselves, then the same argument applies.

In this game, I believe the anarchists are called "neutrals".
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby ElusiveBelle » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:14 pm

The other problem is the Protective roles, lets say at least one of the Randoms rolled Cit, that leaves two slots we're banking on to also have rolled a Town Protective, should the one confirmed one die and leave the Town Power unprotected. Those odds seems pretty low considering all the roles that can be rolled.

Then as a side note, even if they didn't roll the Town Protective. The one we do have can be Doctor, Bg, or Marshal. Two of which can only fend off one person a night leaving the Town Power to be killed by the other evil in town and leave us without a Protective or Power and maybe one dead evil in exchange.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby alouvre » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:14 pm

ily2 tilted <3

ok james
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby RockFire » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:14 pm

TiltedComedian is whispering to alouvre! They have three remaining.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:15 pm

LordofFail wrote:
James2 wrote:And all this stuff about the TPower's competency is besides the point. Obama* is an incompetent fool, but we're still better off with him as President then we would be under anarchy.

*If you're a lib then you can pretend I said Bush.


I am Canadian and do not get your analogy because I dont give two shits about United States politics.


Then pretend I referred to a Canadian Prime Minister that you dislike.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby alouvre » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:17 pm

Regardless of what the prot is, I'm pretty sure their target will still die if they're targeted by more than one killing role.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:17 pm

ElusiveBelle wrote:The other problem is the Protective roles, lets say at least one of the Randoms rolled Cit, that leaves two slots we're banking on to also have rolled a Town Protective, should the one confirmed one die and leave the Town Power unprotected. Those odds seems pretty low considering all the roles that can be rolled.

Then as a side note, even if they didn't roll the Town Protective. The one we do have can be Doctor, Bg, or Marshal. Two of which can only fend off one person a night leaving the Town Power to be killed by the other evil in town and leave us without a Protective or Power and maybe one dead evil in exchange.


Even if the Town Power died night two, they could still help us by giving us info on who's likely to be scum, who's likely town etc
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:18 pm

alouvre wrote:Regardless of what the prot is, I'm pretty sure their target will still die if they're targeted by more than one killing role.

Doctor heals all attacks actually.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby alouvre » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:19 pm

I —

wow
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby ElusiveBelle » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:24 pm

I'm aware lookout and Trans exists. That's still potentially 2 dead town members, non cits by the way, in exchange for 1 evil. It is possible to get two evils but regardless it's still a gamble

I'd support a mayor after the time has passed but any other Power role should probably be more hesitant to reveal.
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Re: 9D (CL) | Nostalgia | Day One (Another Tale)

Postby James2 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 12:24 pm

Kirize12 wrote:
James2 wrote:
Kirize12 wrote:Town Power =/= leadership ability. They may be the leader, but if they're incompetent we will not let them lead.

Honestly, I'm done arguing with you over this. If you wanna blindly follow the Town Power, kindly follow him into a Veteran and save us the trouble of having to deal with your bullshit.


Given that the town is 40% evil, it's not qualified to judge the competence of a confirmed town member. Scum will declare any leader incompetent.

Town is 40% evil and 60% good. Majority rules.
If we declare the Town Power incompetent, I will not allow them, whatever role they might be, to become one of the town leaders.


The masses can easily be lead to think wrongly by a vicious minority, especially when only a few townies are in need of convincing.
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