VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby ejjinami » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:38 pm

aaaaaaaaa why did you hammer royeeeeeeeeeeee

I didn’t really want him lynched
You didn’t even give kosmo enough time to get online xd

I figured that kosmo was the cop after arete died... She kept doubting debil despite him being one of Arete’s cop checks... I tried to put as much attention on myself as possible to bait the kill but it seems that I did it really badly lmao

CheezePie wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:
CheezePie wrote:all the scums were pushed d1 lmfao?

ye

town op

also why the fuck was watchme encouraging a goon/goon/pr/cit rand lmao

reading mafia chat, apparently scum decided to all vote one another

yup xD
mafia love bussing. They LOVE bussing. L. O. V. E. bussing, especially on this site.

and I was a fool to have trusted dota’s meta to that extent. That explains why everyone else felt so townie lmao


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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby Jeeper5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:39 pm

Also thanks to ZSSDistortion for hosting.
37/222!

ISO generator for Python:
Spoiler:
Code: Select all
tN = input("Thread number: ")
pN = int(input("Number of players: "))
pL = []

for x in range(pN):
    pL.append(input("Player " + str(x+1) + " : "))

for x in pL:
    print("[url=https://www.blankmediagames.com/phpbb/search.php?t=" + tN + "&author=" + x + "]" + x + "[/url]")
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:39 pm

watchme1 wrote:Day 1 tldr

I got lazy and started spewing tmi and looking scummy so the best way to recover according to Dota would be to all bus each other and hope for one deep wolf

Which worked out well almost. Probs to debil for not giving up in the worst possible case of a literal 1v10

dota goat
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Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:40 pm

ejjinami wrote:You didn’t even give kosmo enough time to get online xd

That was literally the exact reason I rushed to hammer Royee
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:41 pm

I didn't want anyone who hadn't spoken up to say anything that might draw a kill

You laid a cop claim

I laid a cop claim

That was right where day needed to end.
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:42 pm

Jeeper5 wrote:Well played, everyone. I hope this game kills the "dota doesn't bus" meme once and for all.

I think this game came down to bad NK choices from the mafia. Widely townread or mech-confirmed players (dolphina, orange, Zorua) were left alive, meanwhile people like Hyena (who could have reasonably been pushed D3 using my read on him) and Arete (who was clearly not the cop, at a time when cop-hunting was necessary to avoid an instant town win) were killed.

Agreed, although the excessive turnover rate certainly didn't help with that
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Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby UzayAltay » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:42 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:arguably Debil's best play was to PR hunt twice in a row, as long as he kills the cop by the next check he'll have the plausible deniability that scum had figured out who the cop was and wanted to shade him and cheeze, minimizing his chances of a mechanical loss (which should by far be his largest concern)

I disagree.
Yeah in a normal situation, it would be a bad play, but when Debil need, 4 or 5 mislynch? No. Like I saw when reading the chat of D4 that mafia may have went for it. Yes, normally it is unplayable bad, but, I can say from chess that if something that should be normally unplayable, or bad, seems good because of position is so weird or so bad, than it may be the best option.
I would probably do the same with thinking it is the lesser evil one.

No like

Any amount of looking suspicious is worth the level of reduction in risk of a mechlocked game

You can talk yourself out of looking suspicious sometimes

You can never talk your way out of a mechanical PoE

Yeah, but, the possibility of winning dramatically increase if the plan succeed, maybe even cross 50% when in other three cases, it is just lost or very low probability, probably less than 20% percent, maybe even less.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:43 pm

ejjinami wrote:I tried to put as much attention on myself as possible to bait the kill but it seems that I did it really badly lmao

I mean I thought I did it badly and it ended up working (I was Debil's second choice after Uzay)

So let's just trade, you can think it almost worked and I can think I did it really badly :)
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Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby ejjinami » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:44 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:dota prob scum mvp for this one

yeah... he played with no wim at all but somehow managed to end up looking the most natural
orangeandblack5 wrote:
CheezePie wrote:all the scums were pushed d1 lmfao?

ye

town op

also why the fuck was watchme encouraging a goon/goon/pr/cit rand lmao

Again, mafia love bussing lol

What I was saying before was not bullshit lmao.
There was a strong opposition to watchme’s wagon D1 but no coordination on counterwagons. This likely meant that the scums either sucked or just weren’t trying to save watchme.... Going all out to fake interactions isn’t a completely uncommon thing
They would have only lost 1 scum anyway

I still think that Jackson shouldn’t have been cleared for interactions. (despite being town)
and neither should have dota... but I fell for that one as well ):


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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:44 pm

UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:arguably Debil's best play was to PR hunt twice in a row, as long as he kills the cop by the next check he'll have the plausible deniability that scum had figured out who the cop was and wanted to shade him and cheeze, minimizing his chances of a mechanical loss (which should by far be his largest concern)

I disagree.
Yeah in a normal situation, it would be a bad play, but when Debil need, 4 or 5 mislynch? No. Like I saw when reading the chat of D4 that mafia may have went for it. Yes, normally it is unplayable bad, but, I can say from chess that if something that should be normally unplayable, or bad, seems good because of position is so weird or so bad, than it may be the best option.
I would probably do the same with thinking it is the lesser evil one.

No like

Any amount of looking suspicious is worth the level of reduction in risk of a mechlocked game

You can talk yourself out of looking suspicious sometimes

You can never talk your way out of a mechanical PoE

Yeah, but, the possibility of winning dramatically increase if the plan succeed, maybe even cross 50% when in other three cases, it is just lost or very low probability, probably less than 20% percent, maybe even less.

Unless you have a very good idea who the cop is already, limiting yourself to one chance to hit instead of two is very likely suicide.

Not worth it.
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby watchme1 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:45 pm

ejjinami wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:dota prob scum mvp for this one

yeah... he played with no wim at all but somehow managed to end up looking the most natural
orangeandblack5 wrote:
CheezePie wrote:all the scums were pushed d1 lmfao?

ye

town op

also why the fuck was watchme encouraging a goon/goon/pr/cit rand lmao

Again, mafia love bussing lol

What I was saying before was not bullshit lmao.
There was a strong opposition to watchme’s wagon D1 but no coordination on counterwagons. This likely meant that the scums either sucked or just weren’t trying to save watchme.... Going all out to fake interactions isn’t a completely uncommon thing
They would have only lost 1 scum anyway

I still think that Jackson shouldn’t have been cleared for interactions. (despite being town)
and neither should have dota... but I fell for that one as well ):


Both

We both sucked and also didn t care about saving my ass
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Day 6 (Yoigoshi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:47 pm

ejjinami wrote:I still think that Jackson shouldn’t have been cleared for interactions. (despite being town)

I vehemently disagree with this statement and here's why

They weren't cleared "for interactions" insofar as the point wasn't that their actions didn't feel like they knew the others were scum. They were cleared for a flipped scum having several cases in which they were clearly "handling" the slot, which is incredibly hard to fake even for experienced players. This isn't just any old interaction, it's a case of watchme literally being caught out for dealing with another player in a way that is always going to just be scum from players of this level.
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby Royee » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:50 pm

props to ejjinami for not letting me down and pocketing me day 1
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby ejjinami » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:00 pm

Jeeper5 wrote:Well played, everyone. I hope this game kills the "dota doesn't bus" meme once and for all.

^^^^^^^^
exactly
orangeandblack5 wrote:
ejjinami wrote:I tried to put as much attention on myself as possible to bait the kill but it seems that I did it really badly lmao

I mean I thought I did it badly and it ended up working (I was Debil's second choice after Uzay)

So let's just trade, you can think it almost worked and I can think I did it really badly :)

honestly, I didn;t even notice you crumbing cop xD
The way you handled the cop crumbs/claims D4/D5 screamed cit to me

but good job! xD
orangeandblack5 wrote:
ejjinami wrote:I still think that Jackson shouldn’t have been cleared for interactions. (despite being town)

I vehemently disagree with this statement and here's why

They weren't cleared "for interactions" insofar as the point wasn't that their actions didn't feel like they knew the others were scum. They were cleared for a flipped scum having several cases in which they were clearly "handling" the slot, which is incredibly hard to fake even for experienced players. This isn't just any old interaction, it's a case of watchme literally being caught out for dealing with another player in a way that is always going to just be scum from players of this level.

to me that looked just like fencesitting.
The only thing which could make it look unlike SvS was the lack of a vote imo (only because the mafia were mass-bussing)...

but eh, let’s just agree to disagree here
Royee wrote:props to ejjinami for not letting me down and pocketing me day 1

I have no idea why people were town-reading me when I kept suggesting town counterwagons xD

thanks tho


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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby kosmo16 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:03 pm

If watchme didn't flip Mafia I wouldn't even hypo d2. I was just a little bit worried that watchme could force consig check on me before eod.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:04 pm

@ejji I wasn't townreading you v much D1

D2 I was starting to

D3 I was pretty much there

D4 was what locked it in

that was fun tho glad you were in, was fun to play with you :)
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby UzayAltay » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:04 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:arguably Debil's best play was to PR hunt twice in a row, as long as he kills the cop by the next check he'll have the plausible deniability that scum had figured out who the cop was and wanted to shade him and cheeze, minimizing his chances of a mechanical loss (which should by far be his largest concern)

I disagree.
Yeah in a normal situation, it would be a bad play, but when Debil need, 4 or 5 mislynch? No. Like I saw when reading the chat of D4 that mafia may have went for it. Yes, normally it is unplayable bad, but, I can say from chess that if something that should be normally unplayable, or bad, seems good because of position is so weird or so bad, than it may be the best option.
I would probably do the same with thinking it is the lesser evil one.

No like

Any amount of looking suspicious is worth the level of reduction in risk of a mechlocked game

You can talk yourself out of looking suspicious sometimes

You can never talk your way out of a mechanical PoE

Yeah, but, the possibility of winning dramatically increase if the plan succeed, maybe even cross 50% when in other three cases, it is just lost or very low probability, probably less than 20% percent, maybe even less.

Unless you have a very good idea who the cop is already, limiting yourself to one chance to hit instead of two is very likely suicide.

Not worth it.
Yeah and Do You see Debil winning If We saw , for example, me dead in N3? Objective calculation is good, necessary, but there's two scores at FM, win (1) and lose (0). In chess there is Also draw (0.5).
Now, If You make a play that gives you 0.23 winrate rather Than 0.21 winrate, objectively better play, The problem is, You cannot say "oh I have my 0.23 here, I want to to Take my 0.23 points and leave." If All possibilities are showing very low numbers, for example less Than 0.15, or 0.20, than, make play gives good chance of winning (1), If they succeed at killing cop, really bad? Yeah killing cop was very low odds, though I think We both accept Mafia winning chance goes over 0.50, Maybe more, If they succeed at that.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:05 pm

next level scum plays of deleting your account
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby kosmo16 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:05 pm

Kudos to Arete. Fakeclaiming cop was always the play here. I would do that by myself but you know... (;
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:09 pm

UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:
UzayAltay wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:arguably Debil's best play was to PR hunt twice in a row, as long as he kills the cop by the next check he'll have the plausible deniability that scum had figured out who the cop was and wanted to shade him and cheeze, minimizing his chances of a mechanical loss (which should by far be his largest concern)

I disagree.
Yeah in a normal situation, it would be a bad play, but when Debil need, 4 or 5 mislynch? No. Like I saw when reading the chat of D4 that mafia may have went for it. Yes, normally it is unplayable bad, but, I can say from chess that if something that should be normally unplayable, or bad, seems good because of position is so weird or so bad, than it may be the best option.
I would probably do the same with thinking it is the lesser evil one.

No like

Any amount of looking suspicious is worth the level of reduction in risk of a mechlocked game

You can talk yourself out of looking suspicious sometimes

You can never talk your way out of a mechanical PoE

Yeah, but, the possibility of winning dramatically increase if the plan succeed, maybe even cross 50% when in other three cases, it is just lost or very low probability, probably less than 20% percent, maybe even less.

Unless you have a very good idea who the cop is already, limiting yourself to one chance to hit instead of two is very likely suicide.

Not worth it.
Yeah and Do You see Debil winning If We saw , for example, me dead in N3? Objective calculation is good, necessary, but there's two scores at FM, win (1) and lose (0). In chess there is Also draw (0.5).
Now, If You make a play that gives you 0.23 winrate rather Than 0.21 winrate, objectively better play, The problem is, You cannot say "oh I have my 0.23 here, I want to to Take my 0.23 points and leave." If All possibilities are showing very low numbers, for example less Than 0.15, or 0.20, than, make play gives good chance of winning (1), If they succeed at killing cop, really bad? Yeah killing cop was very low odds, though I think We both accept Mafia winning chance goes over 0.50, Maybe more, If they succeed at that.

Yeah and my point is that number is highest if you PR hunt twice

Any other option has a significantly lower chance of leading to a win imo
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby orangeandblack5 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:09 pm

ICECLIMBERS wrote:next level scum plays of deleting your account

Why didn't I think of it first
Image
Spoiler:
SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby kosmo16 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:09 pm

kosmo16 wrote:Kudos to Arete. Fakeclaiming cop was always the play here. I would do that by myself but you know... (;


Idk why. But I always except these plays from Uzay.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby kosmo16 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:11 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:
ICECLIMBERS wrote:next level scum plays of deleting your account

Why didn't I think of it first


I feel this wins him 2020 Mafia award.
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby Royee » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:11 pm

kosmo16 wrote:Kudos to Arete. Fakeclaiming cop was always the play here. I would do that by myself but you know... (;

No n nope
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Re: VFM75 | Higurashi | Game Over (Matsuribayashi)

Postby kosmo16 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:13 pm

Royee wrote:
kosmo16 wrote:Kudos to Arete. Fakeclaiming cop was always the play here. I would do that by myself but you know... (;

No n nope


What are you saying pickle weasel?
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