SFM74 | ShadowHunters: The Hunt | THE CIRCLE WIN

[TheWabbit]

tells are used in moderation
same applies to rule of 3

you just need to find the right context to use it on

[taylork2]

I guess I'll sort between taylork/harper for now and work from there

Since we're on the topic, I can never get a read on Harper, they honestly come off as very fucking weird. The only thing I can remember from there older meta I could use was they were generally very inactive and quiet when they were scum.
They will probably be null on my reads until they die.

You also assume the dayvig to be town by saying 3 TKs

I don't like this. Cenvil's line of reasoning comes off pretty clearly that among three possible TKs Dolphina is the one that sticks out as the one he believes the least. While Evil making this reply comes off as a low key way of shading Wabbit as scum and/or shaming Cenvil for assuming Wabbit is town.
Evil be more active. It hurts me to see this little content from you.

[teamalex]

Reminder:

I have no motive to try and pull off a mislynch like this if I was a wolf.

I would have to be literally a Suicide Bomber but even then it's very suboptimal play.

Will look at the thread every now and then, going to work in a moment.

[watchme1]

Taylork iso dive

Spoiler:

Goddamn, it's already 10 pages.

Though this might be a good start if not for probable town member being modkilled.

Assuming the lie detection was something along them both being town, I'd say they're both town. There's probably only 1(doubtfully 2) detection immune roles in the game.

First post of the game, comes off as someone who's skimmed through the thread and given his view with the matter with the lie detector. Nai as it can come from either alignment, although the frustration of 'goddamn its already 10 pages, is more likely to come from town than scum as scum have their own chats to vent in.

Hmm, I'm not fully caught up yet, and while I do agree with many of the things Wabbit has said I guess I'm a bit iffy with them. Can't say it's alignemnt indicative.

I think Kosmo is scum. Somewhat due to the lack of content, but moreso with what "content" he has provided. Such as his multiball theory, wanting a massclaim, and these posts.

Zorua claiming cit in the very first post is too stupid to come from scum.

you guys can do whatever the heck you want w/r/t mechanics
I'm just focusing on improving my day play

Wabbit is in general a very forceful person

You already fu*** up, there is no way you can improve.

It really rubs me the wrong way.

Wabbit, you can expand your reasoning on Dolphina?

This read on kosmo is pretty decent, the parts which describe kosmo's scumminess from their oddball comments on multiball theory/massclaim etc. is pretty valid. However some of their reasonings of kosmo being scum with regards to kosmo's toxicity is incorrect as such responses come from either AI. Like sure it rubs on you poorly but it isn't exactly 'scummy' per say.

Their next post (not gonna quote cause the wall would be too big) were regarding dota's sphiel about wall posting being -ev for town and him agreeing with it. NAI stuff for now.

Next up is this interaction with Dota

Dota did have a very terrible hot-take, and should be ashamed for how bad it was.

what was it?

juck and harper both scumread zorua but neither voted her or attempted to start a wagon

at least 1 scum there

everyone else saying this makes me feel validated now
I'm not sure it's likely to come from wolf!dota given how he'd be working in two opposite directions at once
which on the one hand is valuable for the wolf agenda but on the other hand is hard to pull off naturally which this appears to be
or
I don't think dota is the type of wolf to do that kind of thing

I don't think he's scum he's got some other CONtent that more than makes up for such a statement and leads to believe a slight town read(but I really want to iso him before I say that).
and while the statement of 1 of them is scum is probably right(like just over 50%) it's horrible reasoning he should be ashamed for.

Dota

Dota did have a very terrible hot-take, and should be ashamed for how bad it was.

what was it?

juck and harper both scumread zorua but neither voted her or attempted to start a wagon

at least 1 scum there

it's good to test waters and see whether stuff works or not. obviously i'm not aiming at keeping this take for the entirety of day 1

This is not the correct response.
The correct response was everyone is garbage sometimes and spews trash out, not this "I wasn't wrong" response.
Or just ignore what I said. It wasn't real CONtent. The fuck are you doing Dota?

Taylor can go up to the vibing tier ? (aka Weh), the dolphina read seems like a strange one to make as a wolf
I can't talk about the read on myself and have nothing to say about walls so /shrug

The dolphina comment wasn't strange, they were believing that Dolphina was being genuine.
Rest of the wall is meh

This is completely correct.

Mixed feelings on Wabbit

nothing new about that

Probably why I asked for you to be checked, harder slot to solve.

I agree, Wabbit should be checked.

Sparking earlier I thought you were town due to lie detector from lil, but now I feel it. Under the hypothetical circumstance I am a protective role I would do nothing but protect you.

Not gonna say that Taylork is scum reading Dota for not posting actual content cause he's not however it feels really shade-like in that he's criticising dota for being garbage. Not to mention they called out kosmo cause their posts didn't sit with taylork but is doing what kosmo did in said posts. Regardless, its pointless shade which looks bad and I'm potentially leaning S for it. Interaction with Spark is nai here

@taylork you saying something i did is trash will not make me think it's trash too because that's heavily subjective. either give me objective reasoning on why thinking that that pool might have scum is terrible or please do not be toxic about my opinions on the game. i want to have fun and solve and not get shit for it

No, it was pretty objectively a bad take. Both the players can have a myriad of reasons why they wouldn't vote someone immediately for thinking they might be scum.

PoV:

dolphina is frustrated that they're being voted for hidden reasons, proceeds to throw this into meta (which makes the argument stuck on a gray area) through the use of strawman arguments and instead of playing properly they decided to use said frustration as slank cover

i'd discount it as noobtown behavior if i'm stupid enough to not be able to differentiate noobtown behavior in real pressure vs. weak/fake/nonexistent pressure
but i'm not

While I can't dismiss your arguments, going into using Dolphina's post and excuses as Slank cover is possibly shade throwing. I could never condemn them for this back and forth, when I've been in there shoes as a town member, in fact it's pretty tame to some of my responses.
Right now can't connect it to being non-town behavior.

until y'all realize the difference between FM and a battlefield and/or a tea party i'm not toning down

No need, continue the tone.


Juck
If you look through lil's ISO it's pretty obvious what happened.

decent post with regards to dota's 'trash' post, feel like s!taylork would continue to call out dota for being bad but just ends it here so to speak

Well anyways if I'm a dead man, Juck is moron/scum. Kosmo is probably scum, Teamalex stop being so lazy, Dolphina is probably town, someone Check Wabbit.

Okay no fuck you Juck. If I was a dayvig I would kill you right now.

Dumb interactions with Juck which was my basis for SVS potentially. Like you don't need to say that you would just dayvig him out of spite but geh.

S!Taylork -> S!juck -> T!kosmo potentially?

The scummy part about taylork is he is saying i did that to modkill and that's stupidest, not game-related stuff/response

Do, what do you think I was trying to do?

Hide my dead mafia member who will flip at the end of the day?

Whatever. Let's move on.

/vote kosmo

Tentative tr on a naked vote pop-in.

I'm inclined to believe that W!Alex is perfectly capable of doing that
especially since they don't seem to care about how they're read

I agree, I think he did something like this in SFM 21? as mafia.

I'm trying to not conf. bias but this feels like forceful distancing in the event of svs, otherwise pretty poor usage in response with regards to juck should it come form t!taylork.
Basically in the event of t!taylork -> juck's alignment wouldn't be able to be based of it, unless ofc taylork flips scum.

Their response to me about t!kosmo makes sense from t!taylork tbh as i feel s!taylork would try and fabricate more of a objective answer rather than admiting that they have none so town lean for that

Next few posts are just nai info about stuff like how toxicity =/=scummy, and some of their opinions on crimson

@Wabbit
I read through your wall on Dolphina and you did bring up many good points, the vote on me, Cenvil scum theory, and her Juck read.

Though, pretty much all the behavior listed as can be discounted as a combination of inexperience, stuborness and over emotional. Will have to look into it more.

If there's a plan for someone redirecting players into a veteran, may I remind you all redirector is occasionally a mafia role.

This feels really bad to read with regards to redirector being scum!aligned. Yes it is objectively possible but it's bad shade otherwise, since claiming redirector right away is -ev for mafia.

Okay, caught up.

Yeah Dolphina shoudl fullclaim at this point. They've done this to themselves, for no reason.

Dolphina might be scum honestly. Probably one of the best lynches today.

My top lynches right now are
1. Dolphina
2/3. Kosmo
2/3. Watchme

GUYS I'M GONNA GET LYNCHED

/vote teamalex

Now in my eyes this lunch is confirmed

Dolphina, even if your a town member, with your behavior your a net negative to the town's longtime survival.

Progression with dolphina is fine as it was at the time of dolphina's claim for being an auto vet. I'm guessing the kosmo read is similar territory since they've had kosmo as a scum read. Their want to lynch me however is somewhat unjustified as they had me at null but then into a top 3 want to lynch, without any progression in between said posts about their read on me. Maybe im omgusing this a little but at least state why my posts are scum indicative.

Sigh, Dolphina calm down.
Take it from me, having 2-4 players that will always trying to push your lynch isn't something you should worry about. Stop acting crazy and make logical arguments, even if those arguments are fueled by emotion.

Let's start with a question, why would you start claiming against Wabbit. Quote a post or two if it helps.

Explain your reasoning for your actions thusfar, in full.

Good post tbh, while anyone can say that, taylork to come with the iniative to try and dumb down the fire on dolphina is probably town indicative as to not clog up the thread with 'hurr durr lynch dolphina xD' like posts. They're being rational here which is good.

I don't think the rule of 3 is particularly useful in general
just look for ??? reads progressions

Never heard of this exact, rule of three before, but the idea of hiding a team member in your own scum pool as mafia isn't always used, sometimes due to inexperience, wifom, some sense of pride, or just a general development of reactions.

Hotake: Mafia team is Dolphina, Acidic, Watchme, Kosmo, + one other person

Dolphina gives off alot of genuine reactions, but, I'm thinking alot of her reactions here aren't alignment indicative either way, though teamalex's reaction and claim make it likely Dolphina is non-town and a few of Dolphina's post could have scum origins.

Anyways, upon revisiting Juck and me, I actually really like his reaction. It came off as a very primal kind of rage and anger. I'm putting his as my top town read outside of Sparking(this has nothing to do with the Debil's checks).

awake
sorting out IRL issues atm

haven't read but if there's a deadlock or some shit i'm rescinding my dayvig claim
claim was done to force dolphina to face the accusation

cya later

Of course you did.

This is the last post in their iso as of this time of typing it. Said hot take could be tmi as they're theorizing for a 5 mafia team. The way they said its dolphina/acidic/me/kosmo/+ 1 other infers that they know that there's a 5 mafia team rather than just saying the team is just straight up us 4 since we're im assuming the strongest scum reads for taylork.

calling primal rage = town is monkaS but eh whatever

So far they have a mixed bag of shade posts but posts that have good town motivation so i'm kinda lost rn, I feel like I've said more things that are scummy but then that's my conf. bias coming into play so EUGH.

Imma just put this at null before I lose my mind

[watchme1]

tl;dr Mixed feelings on taylork, a bunch of both scummy and towny posts so null

[watchme1]

i was half way through my wall on harper then i pressed the back button and accidentally closed the tab cause i was on another tab so there goes all my wim

[heytheregirl17]

I can tag in if you want
we're to a point where Harper is showing self awareness that they're doing fuck all, and that's not a good sign

[watchme1]

Imma just go off memory

- their entrance post was adventurous and probably town indicative in that they didn't just sheep zorua being town
- Their earlier posts with trying to redirect the lie detector is bad, as the way they put it is another way of saying 'don't check me'
- Their next posts by calling something not productive and not actually producing content as something that isn't scummy but not towny is a hell of a fencesit. I do it sometimes but when something isn't productive nor adding value, that's generally a scum tell, push on it and possible gauge reactions/form reads based off it
- flavour claiming isn't town indicative cause fake claims exist
- One thing i can agree are their latest posts, compiling claims of everyone so town is on the same page is a good thing, even if scum do, like praying that scum don't see it is kinda ??? although not the reason to scum read zorua lol

Overall scum lean

[watchme1]

oh yea about that point with regards to content.

They're doing exactly that, a bunch of posts which look like content but dont' add to discussion or value but is calling zorua out on that

???

[watchme1]

I can tag in if you want
we're to a point where Harper is showing self awareness that they're doing fuck all, and that's not a good sign

if he's self-aware he's a shitter surely he would do smth about it right?

Like i know he's better suited towards the mechanical part of mafia (im kinda in the same boat) but ugh

[watchme1]

jesus christ that took a whole hour to do

[watchme1]

Reminder:

I have no motive to try and pull off a mislynch like this if I was a wolf.

I would have to be literally a Suicide Bomber but even then it's very suboptimal play.

Will look at the thread every now and then, going to work in a moment.

Now that's what scum would say right

[heytheregirl17]

I can tag in if you want
we're to a point where Harper is showing self awareness that they're doing fuck all, and that's not a good sign

if he's self-aware he's a shitter surely he would do smth about it right?

Like i know he's better suited towards the mechanical part of mafia (im kinda in the same boat) but ugh

there's a particular post that comes to mind, let me pull it up
while Elusive is definitely more mechanically inclined, that's NAI by itself, it's the crossover into that self awareness that pings me so hard

[heytheregirl17]

elusive is wolf until further notice

this but actually serious
Harper's done a whole lot of nothing

Harper will get back to you on that, the possibility for maximum memes has come up and has Harper's attention

it's this one
he just kinda gives in on it

[watchme1]

@Dota
Like what Wabbit quoted the comments aren't dissimilar from commenting "good job jailor/vet" and asking for spy claims in ToS.

It's commenting but doing nothing productive. An attempt to look like you're contributing but in reality saying nothing at all.

It's not inherently scummy but it don't get a town read from Harper.

This as well

[taylork2]

Only comment is that I have nothing against that """"toxic"""" post from Kosmo because of it being """"toxic"""" I just don't like it due to the way he bantered. Might not be alignment indicative, but I don't like it.
He could have called Zorua a mother fucker or something, I probably wouldn't have minded.

[watchme1]

lol fair enough

[Crimson97]

Ok after that epic prodge i'm ready to start playing.

[Crimson97]

All ik is that dolphina and alex can't exist together for some reason.

[Cenvil2]

I'm a self-esteem-ruined teen who doesn't know how to live so I assume you're a self-esteem-ruined adult who doesn't know how to live and has given up on trying

One simple tip: with this kind of mentality you will hardly accomplish anything in life. (and this is not restricted to FM.)

-First of all FM is about arguing your takes in the first place, it is not about quarreling over your and other views. (It is an important difference even in the daily life.)
-Projecting your feeling in an argument this hard usually means you don't have any RELEVANT new statement.
-You will never have fun in deduction games with your corrent mentality, and when you not having fun is this clear, it can ruin other player's fun too. (The ones who has more emphathy than Wabbit.)


I really advise you to avoid FM until you FULLY understand the meaning of my points here (at least the first two of the three), and maybe come back later with a more mature mind.
(this is the first time I giving this advise, so you can believe me that I am dead serious with this claim.)

[jucktropy]

Ok I'll request a few words to be written if I die

Is this an act of surrender?

[Crimson97]

[murat1996/SparkingJayYT/Cenvil2] - Good V
[] - Cool V
[jucktropy] - Wooloo V
[TheWabbit/HarperReed/heytheregirl17]
[dolphina/dota2reporter/Taylork2/Crimson97] - Weh V
[Kosmo16]
[EvilDeanius0/polypies73/teamalex] - Noot
[watchme1/cob709?] - Ech W

god tfw juck is your strongest V read

Kinda doomed game if ya ask if juck is your top v read outside of likely conf t

Few questions about your reads - What was about htg that puts them above weh V, same with crimson. Kosmo being slightly v cause they're vibing is basically saying that its nai, cob is essentially doing the same thing as kosmo so why is it scummy. Why was my read transitioned from N->ech W despite me not being on between the readslists you made

We should probably come up with a strategy to force Mafia into a bad position. Since it's D1, I feel like reads are gonna be unreliable until we get someone to provide information. I think the best thing we can do is try and come up with a decent strategy.

Since we don't know the role list, everything kinda sucks.

Suggest something.

[Crimson97]

[murat1996/SparkingJayYT/Cenvil2] - Good V
[] - Cool V
[jucktropy] - Wooloo V
[TheWabbit/HarperReed/heytheregirl17]
[dolphina/dota2reporter/Taylork2/Crimson97] - Weh V
[Kosmo16]
[EvilDeanius0/polypies73/teamalex] - Noot
[watchme1/cob709?] - Ech W

god tfw juck is your strongest V read

Kinda doomed game if ya ask if juck is your top v read outside of likely conf t

Few questions about your reads - What was about htg that puts them above weh V, same with crimson. Kosmo being slightly v cause they're vibing is basically saying that its nai, cob is essentially doing the same thing as kosmo so why is it scummy. Why was my read transitioned from N->ech W despite me not being on between the readslists you made

We should probably come up with a strategy to force Mafia into a bad position. Since it's D1, I feel like reads are gonna be unreliable until we get someone to provide information. I think the best thing we can do is try and come up with a decent strategy.

Since we don't know the role list, everything kinda sucks.

Elusive would love you

Too bad he's not in this game :^(

[Crimson97]

Watchme1 status: Town (probability: 6/10)(edited)
EvilDeanius0 status: TBD
Dota2reporter status: Town (probability: 7/10)
HarperReed: Scum (probability: 4/10)
Murat1996: Town (probability: 10/10)
SparkingJayYT: Town (probability: 9/10)
Cenvil2: Town (probability: 9/10)
Cob709: TBD
Polypies73: TBD
Kosmo16: Town (probability: 3/10)
TheWabbit: Scum (probability: 5/10)
Taylork2: Scum (probability: 6/10)
Crimson97: TBD
Heytheregirl17: Town (probability: 7/10)
Teamalex: TBD
ZoruaLuhansk: Town (probability: 8/10)
Jucktropy: Town (probability: 6/10)
Lilgangsta: Town (probability: 9/10)(edited)
Labeled as Town: Watchme1, Dota2reporter, Murat1996, SparkingJayYT, Cenvil2, Kosmo16, Heytheregirl17, ZoruaLuhansk, lilgangsta, and Jucktropy
Labeled as scum: TheWabbit, Taylork2, and HarperReed

Copy pasted from notes

Yeah, that's how my grades look.

[jucktropy]

[murat1996/SparkingJayYT/Cenvil2] - Good V
[] - Cool V
[jucktropy] - Wooloo V
[TheWabbit/HarperReed/heytheregirl17]
[dolphina/dota2reporter/Taylork2/Crimson97] - Weh V
[Kosmo16]
[EvilDeanius0/polypies73/teamalex] - Noot
[watchme1/cob709?] - Ech W

god tfw juck is your strongest V read

Kinda doomed game if ya ask if juck is your top v read outside of likely conf t

Few questions about your reads - What was about htg that puts them above weh V, same with crimson. Kosmo being slightly v cause they're vibing is basically saying that its nai, cob is essentially doing the same thing as kosmo so why is it scummy. Why was my read transitioned from N->ech W despite me not being on between the readslists you made

We should probably come up with a strategy to force Mafia into a bad position. Since it's D1, I feel like reads are gonna be unreliable until we get someone to provide information. I think the best thing we can do is try and come up with a decent strategy.

Since we don't know the role list, everything kinda sucks.

Elusive would love you

Too bad he's not in this game :^(

It's like this joke wasn't made a few post ago