In regards to asking for title card information as evidence

[germankamikazi]

I specifically was jailed and the jailer asked me what the 4th word in my goal was. I was the mafioso so I had to lie and tell him I'm the vigilante and guess what that word is. After about 10 seconds (possibly looking up the vigilantes goal) he came back and said I was lying and executed me. Personally I believe this is against the spirit of the game. If he believed I was lying and executed me, fine, but to ask for specific information in a role card or useing it during a defense is against the spirit of the game. I don't believe a player should have to memorize or consult the wiki to play the game. It is about using an individuals knowledge of the roles, how they work, and what a person says as the basis of their game-play.

My personal suggestion is to make it known that asking for information specific to role cards or wills (copy and pasting wills into chat) as means of accusation or defense is against the spirit of the game and therefore should not be used in Town of Salem henceforth.

[ciary]

I disagree.
just as much as he looked it up, so could you have. since the idea of mafia is covering yourself against these things, I always have all rolecards open in a separate tab to counter these questions. I also have a default will to do something similar.
honestly, if you don't like these kind of questions, make sure ou can easily counter them. you don't have to know all rolecards by hard to do so you know

[Jtgop]

I disagree.
just as much as he looked it up, so could you have. since the idea of mafia is covering yourself against these things, I always have all rolecards open in a separate tab to counter these questions. I also have a default will to do something similar.
honestly, if you don't like these kind of questions, make sure ou can easily counter them. you don't have to know all rolecards by hard to do so you know

Many people, myself included, don't want to have to have 50 windows open in order to play the game, and even if we did do this, in the end it nets us nothing, because if everyone uses the technique, and the counter, we are just using more resources to get the same results. When I am playing the game, the game window should be sufficient to play effectively, and you could easily argue that anything else breaks the 'no outside information that may give you an unfair advantage' rule. That said, I know they are adding a list of all the role cards to the in game interface, shame they have to do that when they could be working on something else.

[infavol]

I also encountered this situation, and was pretty annoyed. As a disclaimer: I guessed correctly on mine. I have a really good memory and managed to say the first 4 words in the lookout role card, but that doesn't change the fact that I shouldn't have had to. Like Jtgop said, it's not really in the spirit of the game to have a bunch of references to help you with the game and one up other players. Now I'm all for going through information before hand and really learning the game inside out; knowing all the roles, their goals, attributes, win scenarios: this stuff is key to becoming a great player and it takes a lot of time and skill to be able to used it on the fly, but just having it pulled up for a quick kill is unfair to the one screen player. This game is all in the mind and how you communicate your thoughts to those you think are on your side: having references to help is a bad crutch.

[iggyvolz]

Duplicate of this thread and many others.

Then again, this is completely my stance on the issue. It completely takes away from the illusion of the game (imagine you walk into a court and are asked "Please read your role card"). In addition, you should not be forced to have another window open, nor should the developers need to put all the role cards in the game as they are just there for advice.

I personally will never read my role card for anyone else, whether I am or am not that role (except in an obvioulsy fake manner as a jester - did that once as SK as a reverse psychology and almost got away). The developers have stated that it is a tactic they do not like, but they have not gone so far as to say it is illegal.

[Abbyka]

Not only that but some users cannot type fast enough to respond in the time given. I had someone tell me I had 5 seconds to tell them the first LINE of my "role" when I was mafia. Obviously I had no time to open wiki but I was also at a disadvantage as I'm typing with a bandaged thumb the past few days. Even without this some people just aren't fast typers. Just because some are doesn't mean all are. That's an unfair thing to ask of someone. 50% of the time they are going to execute an innocent person.

[LevinSnakesRise]

Role cards will be placed in-game so that this tactic doesn't work. Just deal with it, or refuse to answer. That's what I always do, then talk down to them about how poor of a strategy they try to play, and mention they won't be able to use it for much longer because of role cards. (Not in a mean way, more like stern, in 30 seconds, lol)

[Abbyka]

Well by not answering the guy who was jailer for me immediately executed me without flinching. :/ I hope role cards help

[GaaraOfDaFunk]

I specifically was jailed and the jailer asked me what the 4th word in my goal was. I was the mafioso so I had to lie and tell him I'm the vigilante and guess what that word is. After about 10 seconds (possibly looking up the vigilantes goal) he came back and said I was lying and executed me. Personally I believe this is against the spirit of the game. If he believed I was lying and executed me, fine, but to ask for specific information in a role card or useing it during a defense is against the spirit of the game. I don't believe a player should have to memorize or consult the wiki to play the game. It is about using an individuals knowledge of the roles, how they work, and what a person says as the basis of their game-play.

My personal suggestion is to make it known that asking for information specific to role cards or wills (copy and pasting wills into chat) as means of accusation or defense is against the spirit of the game and therefore should not be used in Town of Salem henceforth.

All town members have the same goal. "Lynch every criminal and evildoer" if you can remember that then you should be good.

As for the "copy and paste your last will" I think that is more BS than asking for role card info IMHO. I mean if you are in jail you would not have access to your last will (since last wills are generally kept in a house) so you wouldn't have it on you.

A way to combat that tactic though:
Spoiler: If you are mafasio (or any mafia for that matter) MAKE A BS LAST WILL! IF YOU ARE MAFASIO THEN SAY "My name the vigalante N1- nothing N2- No evidence N3- so on and so forth" IF YOU ARE CONSIG SAY "My name the Investagator n1- Bob = jailor bodyguard or lookout n2- Sarah = Doctor or Serial Killer" ESCORT=CONSORT, JANITOR= MEDIUM.
There are ways to fool the town. You just need to know how to do it.... fake wills and memorizing the pharse " Lynch every criminal and evildoer " will help.

[iggyvolz]

As for the "copy and paste your last will" I think that is more BS than asking for role card info IMHO. I mean if you are in jail you would not have access to your last will (since last wills are generally kept in a house) so you wouldn't have it on you.

Yeah, usually I just BS in jail, making it up on the spot. Picking random players and acting confident usually helps.

[Kia]

I disagree.
just as much as he looked it up, so could you have. since the idea of mafia is covering yourself against these things, I always have all rolecards open in a separate tab to counter these questions. I also have a default will to do something similar.
honestly, if you don't like these kind of questions, make sure ou can easily counter them. you don't have to know all rolecards by hard to do so you know

What is to stop a person from asking for a screenshot? I honestly think if you need to use outside sources for a game on the off chance you are asked a question, then the game is broken in at least some sense.

[Deathwolfgaming]

I disagree.
just as much as he looked it up, so could you have. since the idea of mafia is covering yourself against these things, I always have all rolecards open in a separate tab to counter these questions. I also have a default will to do something similar.
honestly, if you don't like these kind of questions, make sure ou can easily counter them. you don't have to know all rolecards by hard to do so you know

What is to stop a person from asking for a screenshot? I honestly think if you need to use outside sources for a game on the off chance you are asked a question, then the game is broken in at least some sense.

Because as stated in The Terms of Use you are not allowed to use screenshots for proof. Now, back to the topic at hand, you could easily look it up, true, but of course he would get suspicious of you not answering for a while. Its cheap, but still allowed. I personally don't use it, but there are that doe, and you must find out how to lie to them.

[Jtgop]

I disagree.
just as much as he looked it up, so could you have. since the idea of mafia is covering yourself against these things, I always have all rolecards open in a separate tab to counter these questions. I also have a default will to do something similar.
honestly, if you don't like these kind of questions, make sure ou can easily counter them. you don't have to know all rolecards by hard to do so you know

What is to stop a person from asking for a screenshot? I honestly think if you need to use outside sources for a game on the off chance you are asked a question, then the game is broken in at least some sense.

Because as stated in The Terms of Use you are not allowed to use screenshots for proof. Now, back to the topic at hand, you could easily look it up, true, but of course he would get suspicious of you not answering for a while. Its cheap, but still allowed. I personally don't use it, but there are that doe, and you must find out how to lie to them.

What makes you allowed to look up another role's role card? that sounds a lot to me like using a third party program to secure an unfair advantage.

[GaaraOfDaFunk]

Wait what? No to the wills! There is no reason why you can't write a fake one at all, just like how you can lie about your role. It is a huge part of the game and you can't just disallow it, even if you did it would still happen anyway in every game, and if anyone did get banned for it there would be complaints everywhere.

Who said anything about disallowing the " copy and paste your last will " tactic?
I am not a fan of it. I only said that asking for the last will was more BS than asking for the role card info.

(IF it was up to me you would be unable to copy your last will while in jail because you would not carry your last will with you when you are hauled to jail) but since it isn't up to me, I always keep an updated last will if I am town.... and an updated BS last will if I am mafia.

[SlyLara]

I think requiring you to copy paste anything is unfair. the last will should not be seen by anyone else until your dead.

[TheSwordDancer]

I don't think it should be against the rules since it's simply a bad tactic for town to use. Any strong player is gonna have a reference written down or in another tab for their 'alibi' role, so this doesn't even prove that someone is town even if they quickly answer correctly. Against weak players this tactic might just get them killed if they don't understand the terminology or what's being asked of them fast enough, and might get hanged for tanking long enough that people think they're 'looking it up'.

[lionon]

The devs said they plan on having all role cards available to be visiable from in game. WIth this any form of rolecard reading is gone for.

In the meantime open this in a tab:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... li=1#gid=0

[lionon]

btw. i usually sabotage role card reading since i hate it. if i am bad, i look it up in the docs and if i am a townie, i tell the jailor to screw himself if he wants my card read.

[chitownmvp01]

btw. i usually sabotage role card reading since i hate it. if i am bad, i look it up in the docs and if i am a townie, i tell the jailor to screw himself if he wants my card read.

That's the way I would feel. In fact, I actually used the role-card reading tactic when I was newer to the game and less experienced, but I don't use this tactic anymore when I realized that it was ineffective. I bet multiple people did the same though. However, I wouldn't tell the Jailor to screw himself if I'm a townie, Neutral, or mafia, if it's going to result in getting executed.

[lionon]

well i say literally "I don't do role card reading".

If the jailor decides to execute me because of this it will be a lesson.

[chitownmvp01]

well i say literally "I don't do role card reading".

If the jailor decides to execute me because of this it will be a lesson.

I usually just do it when asked and then at the end of the game I tell them it's a bad tactic. I would rather not want to risk getting executed because of disobeying the Jailor.

[Ansem555]

well i say literally "I don't do role card reading".

If the jailor decides to execute me because of this it will be a lesson.

I usually just do it when asked and then at the end of the game I tell them it's a bad tactic. I would rather not want to risk getting executed because of disobeying the Jailor.

Quite honestly, if it's just as much in the grey area to ask to read a rolecard, it's in the same grey area to refuse to answer even if you're town because it's in the grey area. Waiting to tell them at the end isn't effective because after the win or lose they could insta-leave, might as well shut them down early.

[Regibald]

Why is it not specifically against the rules to force people to read their role cards?

It is implied in section V:H

But would it not be better to specifically outlaw this behavior?

It seems like it would lead to people copying and pasting every role card and fake claims boiling down to copying and pasting

[iggyvolz]

Posted numerous times before - see viewtopic.php?f=14&t=15813 for example.

[Regibald]

This behavior is against the rules in the SC2 version of this game, of which this game is a copy.