Details of upcoming patch

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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Supertcgamer » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:01 am

FrenchyTheSphee wrote:This is a step in the right direction, but as Yourdirtyuncle said


There are so many more changes that need to happen for the game to stop being an instant town win meta

Jailor, Mayor, Transporter, Medium, Janitor and Lookout need nerfs

Forger, Disguiser, Every single NK, Blackmailer, Framer, Mafioso need huge buffs


Before that happens the game will be the same


Blackmailer is fine the way it is, all you need to do is not blackmail randomly, use whispers to claim roles like inves.

Mayor is fine the way it is. The only problem with mayor is jailor and transporter.

Nerf janitor? This role is balance and loved by many. Just randomly jailing the janitor gets him or her caught is maf is stupid enough to attack.

Medium is already in a bad spot, nerf medium? The role does need a few tweaks, I say it all depends on the role list and making med unique. Add medium to the role list so players are encouraged to stay and make it where there can be only one.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby ZedKiller13 » Sun Jul 12, 2020 10:46 pm

When the protection feedback messages is changed for Doctor and Crusader, does that mean attacking roles only see “Your targets Defense was too high!” or something along those lines, and the attacked person no longer sees if they were healed or protected or not? If so, will Hypnotist be changing some of its messages to reflect that?

Just for clarification.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby MysticMismagius » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:13 pm

Supertcgamer wrote:
FrenchyTheSphee wrote:This is a step in the right direction, but as Yourdirtyuncle said

There are so many more changes that need to happen for the game to stop being an instant town win meta

Jailor, Mayor, Transporter, Medium, Janitor and Lookout need nerfs

Forger, Disguiser, Every single NK, Blackmailer, Framer, Mafioso need huge buffs

Before that happens the game will be the same
Blackmailer is fine the way it is, all you need to do is not blackmail randomly, use whispers to claim roles like inves.
Blackmailer is not fine, it's super degenerate
You can basically remove one extra person from the game by blackmailing them constantly

Supertcgamer wrote:Mayor is fine the way it is. The only problem with mayor is jailor and transporter.
Mayor actually does have an issue inherent to the role itself right now, and it's the half-assed Macho status the role has
It can't be protected by Doctor and Doctor only meaning that how powerful it is depends heavily on which TP spawns
Mayor should either be fully Macho (unable to be protected by any TP) when revealed, or it should be allowed to be healed and there should be some other drawback to revealing to replace its half-Macho status

Supertcgamer wrote:Nerf janitor? This role is balance and loved by many. Just randomly jailing the janitor gets him or her caught is maf is stupid enough to attack.
I'm with you on that first part, Janitor is one of Mafia's few really good roles and it doesn't need to be nerfed
Last sentence is definitely not true, Jani has limited charges so it's entirely possible that if the Jani didn't clean one day, it's because they just decided to hold onto their cleans (or ran out of them, if the Mafia has missed a kill)

Supertcgamer wrote:Medium is already in a bad spot, nerf medium? The role does need a few tweaks, I say it all depends on the role list and making med unique. Add medium to the role list so players are encouraged to stay and make it where there can be only one.
Nah, Medium's fine for now
It was only ever a problem because of Ret, so now that Ret is being reworked, we should wait and see how the game plays out before we consider making changes to Medium
Last edited by MysticMismagius on Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby OreCreeper » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:14 pm

ZedKiller13 wrote:When the protection feedback messages is changed for Doctor and Crusader, does that mean attacking roles only see “Your targets Defense was too high!” or something along those lines, and the attacked person no longer sees if they were healed or protected or not? If so, will Hypnotist be changing some of its messages to reflect that?

Just for clarification.

I think the attacked person will still know, the feedback is only for the attacker I think.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby kyuss420 » Mon Jul 13, 2020 2:15 am

ZedKiller13 wrote:When the protection feedback messages is changed for Doctor and Crusader, does that mean attacking roles only see “Your targets Defense was too high!” or something along those lines, and the attacked person no longer sees if they were healed or protected or not? If so, will Hypnotist be changing some of its messages to reflect that?

Just for clarification.


logic would suggest, as doc and crus grant their target powerful defence, then that is what the attacker will see - that their targets defence was too high. The feedback ''you were healed'' and ''you were protected'' shouldnt change.

As for hypno, 95% of the messages need an overhaul.... Thats probably a bit exaggerated... using 95% of the messages early game, just out the fact that theres a hypno.. maybe 50% of them need an overhaul... might start a thread on hypno messages one day, I dont think devs would consider it high priority as it only gets used in CAA.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby MysticMismagius » Mon Jul 13, 2020 9:43 am

kyuss420 wrote:As for hypno, 95% of the messages need an overhaul.... Thats probably a bit exaggerated... using 95% of the messages early game, just out the fact that theres a hypno.. maybe 50% of them need an overhaul... might start a thread on hypno messages one day, I dont think devs would consider it high priority as it only gets used in CAA.
Honestly go for it
I'd read it
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby FrenchyTheSphee » Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:30 pm

Soulshade55r wrote:
Brilliand wrote:
Soulshade55r wrote:
How I'd nerf LO is by buffing framer indirect nerfs is needed for LO like making framer make LO see fake visits (aka focus Framer)

In general Lo isn't that powerful in coven with ambushers and Crusaders making roles that can effect it's power are useful, LO is generally a fine role though imo.



What if the Random Mafia isn't framer?

Does that mean Lo meta is still on board?
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby FrenchyTheSphee » Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:45 pm

For everyone saying Medium is alright and Mayor is okay

My problem with these roles and Jailor and Transporter, in general, is that they are easily comfortable. I could even add Spy in the mix, but he should be getting reworked either way so I don't care.

The problem with easily confirmable roles is that it lowers Mafia claim spaces; legit the only claims that Mafia can claim is as follows:

Sherrif (The highest claimed role for every evil by the way)
Vigilante (Should only be claimed by Neutral killings, Forger, Godfather, and Mafioso only if he is outed by Invest. DON'T EVER CLAIM VIGILANTE AS MAFIOSO UNLESS YOU MUST DO SO)
Veteran
Investigator (Pretty tough for Mafia to pull off but I've seen some plays)
Bodyguard and Doctor (Really boring claims that are just there if you can't find something)
Escort (Impossible for all roles except Consort also gets absolutely fucked by Spy)

Now for the Situational Claims

Transporter (If there are a lot of Transporters and you can just create a crap ton of chaos)
Retributionist (For one free night. Also don't claim Retributionist as Mafia in a Janitor game. You will get hung)
Mayor (if you legit have no other claim and you are gonna get executed in Jail)


And that's it there are EIGHT ROLES that Mafia can not ever claim if they want to continue playing the game: Jailor, Lo, Med, Mayor, Spy, Transporter, Escort (unless playing Consort), Retributionist

There are Thirteen roles in the game (Excluding Coven town roles and Vampire hunter)

Mafia can not claim 3/4 of the roles in the game, that just sounds unfair to me.

Make roles less confirmable and you will see Mafia winrates skyrocket
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Brilliand » Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:37 pm

FrenchyTheSphee wrote:What if the Random Mafia isn't framer?

Does that mean Lo meta is still on board?


If the Town can confirm that there's no Framer, yes. But usually the Town doesn't know.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby DeathGallower » Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:49 pm

With Juggernaut being more likely to spawn, can you please give it a legitimate investigative result like it deserves?
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Mon Jul 13, 2020 10:36 pm

DeathGallower wrote:With Juggernaut being more likely to spawn, can you please give it a legitimate investigative result like it deserves?

Agreed

I'd likely go with BG/GF/Arso/Crus/Jugg likely the best slot for jugg to currently go in.

It would be nice in general to look at juggernauts role card on the neutral killer slot ect. I generally want Juggernaut treated like a normal Nk at this point

And that's it there are EIGHT ROLES that Mafia can not ever claim if they want to continue playing the game: Jailor, Lo, Med, Mayor, Spy, Transporter, Escort (unless playing Consort), Retributionist


Jailor, Situational but you can claim Jailor with a Janitor + no meta Jailor
LO, In general lookout is my go to claim as RM in ranked it's actually worked wonders for me, open claims are your best friend and if you're not confident in your N1 being right then prepare another fake claim
Mayor, yes only in Jail.
Spy, ??? you realise RM can visit jailor if you are talking about spies being confirmed by LO, in general spy is in a bad spot for a role balance wise but it's nowhere near "unfakeabe"
Transporter I've done it before it's worked out it's backfired sometimes but in general it's worked out for me.
Escort, I mean like pretending to rb mafia having a forger, ect helps you can fake claim escort if jailor isn't open but unlike trans there's no real reson not to rb Jailor n1
Retri, use it as a get out of jail free card if you really need to, Retri getting reworked soon into something that is actually able to be faked imo.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Elespider12 » Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:09 pm

FrenchyTheSphee wrote:For everyone saying Medium is alright and Mayor is okay

My problem with these roles and Jailor and Transporter, in general, is that they are easily comfortable. I could even add Spy in the mix, but he should be getting reworked either way so I don't care.

The problem with easily confirmable roles is that it lowers Mafia claim spaces; legit the only claims that Mafia can claim is as follows:

Sherrif (The highest claimed role for every evil by the way)
Vigilante (Should only be claimed by Neutral killings, Forger, Godfather, and Mafioso only if he is outed by Invest. DON'T EVER CLAIM VIGILANTE AS MAFIOSO UNLESS YOU MUST DO SO)
Veteran
Investigator (Pretty tough for Mafia to pull off but I've seen some plays)
Bodyguard and Doctor (Really boring claims that are just there if you can't find something)
Escort (Impossible for all roles except Consort also gets absolutely fucked by Spy)

Now for the Situational Claims

Transporter (If there are a lot of Transporters and you can just create a crap ton of chaos)
Retributionist (For one free night. Also don't claim Retributionist as Mafia in a Janitor game. You will get hung)
Mayor (if you legit have no other claim and you are gonna get executed in Jail)


And that's it there are EIGHT ROLES that Mafia can not ever claim if they want to continue playing the game: Jailor, Lo, Med, Mayor, Spy, Transporter, Escort (unless playing Consort), Retributionist

There are Thirteen roles in the game (Excluding Coven town roles and Vampire hunter)

Mafia can not claim 3/4 of the roles in the game, that just sounds unfair to me.

Make roles less confirmable and you will see Mafia winrates skyrocket


While I agree with the overall point you're making, I think Spy, Medium, and Retributionist (Now that it's been reworked) are all somewhat fake-claimable.

Spy has always been easier to fake than Invest in my opinion. Obviously you're in trouble if your n1 bug on Jailor is wrong, but if nothing happens, Jailor doesn't claim, or you get controlled, It tends to be pretty smooth sailing from there.

Now that Retri can't be used to confirm Med, the only time it becomes a difficult claim is when there's a dead role like LO which is hard to fake a night's will from, or if there's other Mediums, which should end in a 1 for 1 most of the time.

Claiming Retri shouldn't actually be that difficult now. As long as there aren't any Lookouts, Vigilantes, or Escorts dead, it should actually make for a pretty easy claim.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby FrenchyTheSphee » Tue Jul 14, 2020 3:17 pm

Soulshade55r wrote:
And that's it there are EIGHT ROLES that Mafia can not ever claim if they want to continue playing the game: Jailor, Lo, Med, Mayor, Spy, Transporter, Escort (unless playing Consort), Retributionist


Jailor, Situational but you can claim Jailor with a Janitor + no meta Jailor
LO, In general lookout is my go to claim as RM in ranked it's actually worked wonders for me, open claims are your best friend and if you're not confident in your N1 being right then prepare another fake claim
Mayor, yes only in Jail.
Spy, ??? you realise RM can visit jailor if you are talking about spies being confirmed by LO, in general spy is in a bad spot for a role balance wise but it's nowhere near "unfakeabe"
Transporter I've done it before it's worked out it's backfired sometimes but in general it's worked out for me.
Escort, I mean like pretending to rb mafia having a forger, ect helps you can fake claim escort if jailor isn't open but unlike trans there's no real reson not to rb Jailor n1
Retri, use it as a get out of jail free card if you really need to, Retri getting reworked soon into something that is actually able to be faked imo.




1: Whenever there is a Janitor game where Jailor did not come out (which is the most gamethrowy thing a Jailor can do in Ranked imo) Jailor claims are always suspected to the point that if no executions happen the Jailor claim gets hung

2: I am legit curious. How could you ever claim Lookout as Rm??? How do you find the Tps and other Los or other visits on Jailor please make me learn I would like to try out claiming Lo

And Also even if you do get those claims and somehow find all the Tps and visits on Jailor in some days this is how I would see a situation like this happen:

You (Fake claiming Lookout n2 or n3 and you are Jailed by Jailor)
Jailor

Jailor: Role
You: Lookout
Jailor: Will?
You: You the Lookout: n1: Jailor visited by (Tp 1, Tp 2, Ti 3, Ti 4, Escort 1)
Jailor: Why didn't you whisper me the results when the second day started?
You: ????
Jailor has decided to execute you
You: Fuck

3: Transporter is the closest townie you can claim because I have seen a lot of transporter claims in Ranked and it's always fun seeing what they manage to make. I feel like Trans is in a gray area where it is hard to claim as Mafia but it is possible in some situations

Also, Transporter is a really risky and unreliable claim since if you ever get outed or get hung you will be outing 1-2 Mafia with you as you die. I just don't like the Transporter gamble it should be a bit more fair for Mafia. Having Hypno in Ranked would fix this completely

4: If you are Escort and you are not on Jailor n1 you are gonna be lynched. Even if you are confirmed by spy or I don't fucking care who

You will be lynched or executed If I am in the game

5: Yep Retri should hopefully start becoming a better claim for Mafia in the future, nothing more to add here

6: Spy: you can not claim Spy as Gf or Mafioso obviously. But mainly Spy claiming just gets destroyed if you get a bad bug, It's even more of a risky gamble than claiming Transporter in my opinion. Because one wrong bug and you are out of the game while with Transporter you are usually trusted unless you are only transporting yourself with someone else all the time

7: Ooo a secret number 7 yes it's medium. The reason I am saying Medium is strong is because he can be confirmed. NOT BY RETRIBUTIONIST, but Medium can copy-paste dead chat in seconds and can easily get a whisper from a dead townie to confirm himself being a Medium confirms yourself so easily that you are just confirmed. And it is literally impossible for Mafia to copy-paste as fast as a real Medium to look legit period.

Medium will still be overpowered as just a comfortable townie and a claim that Mafia can not ever claim
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Tue Jul 14, 2020 10:36 pm

FrenchyTheSphee wrote:
Soulshade55r wrote:
And that's it there are EIGHT ROLES that Mafia can not ever claim if they want to continue playing the game: Jailor, Lo, Med, Mayor, Spy, Transporter, Escort (unless playing Consort), Retributionist


Jailor, Situational but you can claim Jailor with a Janitor + no meta Jailor
LO, In general lookout is my go to claim as RM in ranked it's actually worked wonders for me, open claims are your best friend and if you're not confident in your N1 being right then prepare another fake claim
Mayor, yes only in Jail.
Spy, ??? you realise RM can visit jailor if you are talking about spies being confirmed by LO, in general spy is in a bad spot for a role balance wise but it's nowhere near "unfakeabe"
Transporter I've done it before it's worked out it's backfired sometimes but in general it's worked out for me.
Escort, I mean like pretending to rb mafia having a forger, ect helps you can fake claim escort if jailor isn't open but unlike trans there's no real reson not to rb Jailor n1
Retri, use it as a get out of jail free card if you really need to, Retri getting reworked soon into something that is actually able to be faked imo.




1: Whenever there is a Janitor game where Jailor did not come out (which is the most gamethrowy thing a Jailor can do in Ranked imo) Jailor claims are always suspected to the point that if no executions happen the Jailor claim gets hung

2: I am legit curious. How could you ever claim Lookout as Rm??? How do you find the Tps and other Los or other visits on Jailor please make me learn I would like to try out claiming Lo

And Also even if you do get those claims and somehow find all the Tps and visits on Jailor in some days this is how I would see a situation like this happen:

You (Fake claiming Lookout n2 or n3 and you are Jailed by Jailor)
Jailor

Jailor: Role
You: Lookout
Jailor: Will?
You: You the Lookout: n1: Jailor visited by (Tp 1, Tp 2, Ti 3, Ti 4, Escort 1)
Jailor: Why didn't you whisper me the results when the second day started?
You: ????
Jailor has decided to execute you
You: Fuck

3: Transporter is the closest townie you can claim because I have seen a lot of transporter claims in Ranked and it's always fun seeing what they manage to make. I feel like Trans is in a gray area where it is hard to claim as Mafia but it is possible in some situations

Also, Transporter is a really risky and unreliable claim since if you ever get outed or get hung you will be outing 1-2 Mafia with you as you die. I just don't like the Transporter gamble it should be a bit more fair for Mafia. Having Hypno in Ranked would fix this completely

4: If you are Escort and you are not on Jailor n1 you are gonna be lynched. Even if you are confirmed by spy or I don't fucking care who

You will be lynched or executed If I am in the game

5: Yep Retri should hopefully start becoming a better claim for Mafia in the future, nothing more to add here

6: Spy: you can not claim Spy as Gf or Mafioso obviously. But mainly Spy claiming just gets destroyed if you get a bad bug, It's even more of a risky gamble than claiming Transporter in my opinion. Because one wrong bug and you are out of the game while with Transporter you are usually trusted unless you are only transporting yourself with someone else all the time

7: Ooo a secret number 7 yes it's medium. The reason I am saying Medium is strong is because he can be confirmed. NOT BY RETRIBUTIONIST, but Medium can copy-paste dead chat in seconds and can easily get a whisper from a dead townie to confirm himself being a Medium confirms yourself so easily that you are just confirmed. And it is literally impossible for Mafia to copy-paste as fast as a real Medium to look legit period.

Medium will still be overpowered as just a comfortable townie and a claim that Mafia can not ever claim


1. I mean a lot of jailors are actually refusing to claim to meta game, I don't generally claim d1 myself because the arsonist gamble.

2. LO in general is a harder claim to make as Rm, spies generally will out d2 so it will be easy, any other Tps will be generally vfr'd or will whisper Jailor (Keep in mind other invests like to do that). Also dead players, It's a hard thing to pull off put aslong as you have another fakeclaim (preferably Tp as you visited the Jailor n1). I've never had a jailor exe me in jail because I didn't whisper them because a LO claim looks "Confirmed"

3. Transporter will always come with that risk, too bad hypnotist will generally always be "coven locked" even though it could provide help for the mafia that in general they lack, heck hypno and the other rm could visit Jailor making a fake Rb message, the other rm claims Escort (doesn't have to be consort) While the other fakes Tp and can use a fake heal message a couple days later if mafia is being jailed/Rb'd

4. nah personally I've seen it go either way I'lll agree that escort is likely really hard to claim but Consort exists at least, just need spy to be reworked (god I hate how spy is right now one of the most unhealthy roles)

6. eh the only real bug spy gets is "Rb'd" generally on n1, most Jailors I've came across don't expect you to be on him all game. (Again I think spy is a very toxic role that needs a complete redesign).

7. I have faked medium as Sk before and won a game by fake pasting dead chat that I prepared making during the game when I didn't need to talk, it worked out really well I generally don't claim medium due to retri and other medims but I might try it again once the rework comes
I really doubt medium is actually "over powered" I've never seen Jailor give out medium codes ect. But that is a future problem that may arise, I personally as medium do the medium code to confirm myself to a couple of players
(Aka ask people to whisper a certain code to someone and I can confirm to the person they whispered to (or got whispered by) but I generally don't see a lot of players do this

What elo u at? maybe your at a higher elo then me and how they play is way more enforced around the meta (I'm at 1801 currently)
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby FrenchyTheSphee » Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:28 am

@soulsahd55r I am at around 2400 - 2500 elo, but we should get matched up together I have been matched before with 1600s and 1400s
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Wed Jul 15, 2020 11:26 am

FrenchyTheSphee wrote:@soulsahd55r I am at around 2400 - 2500 elo, but we should get matched up together I have been matched before with 1600s and 1400s

Woah I generally only have played ranked for month (I was on a long break from the game). but I guess you do know what you are talking about in ranked regard

(Right now I generally spend my time mostly In TT).
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby coffeelovinggamer » Wed Jul 15, 2020 11:37 am

Most of these changes are good, but I dislike the taunts. It doesn't just stop the dead communicating with the living, which honestly - since the taunts can be from anyone and people taunt on top of taunt doesn't really seem to be an issue much - but it also stops things like being able to taunt your target as EXE when a TI dies. I've used that a few times and it's a fun way to get a little help getting my target lynched.. by making out the dead person is taunting them when it's me. That wouldn't work now. Mafia and NK can use it the same way to create chaos. It works for everyone - I don't know why we're changing something that everyone can use equally.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby James2 » Wed Jul 15, 2020 1:16 pm

I really don't think abolishing the Ret (which is what is happening here, even if an entirely different role is given the same name) will be good for the game.

Nerfing taunts is a great step in the right direction. Though it should be entirely impossible for dead players to use them on the living.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:09 pm

James2 wrote:I really don't think abolishing the Ret (which is what is happening here, even if an entirely different role is given the same name) will be good for the game.

Nerfing taunts is a great step in the right direction. Though it should be entirely impossible for dead players to use them on the living.



What concept of ret is remotely good? we already have a role that's meant to gather information from the dead that's called medium.
Whats good about doing one thing the entire game then being confirmed? nothing, the concept isn't a good one and is beyond fixing that's why it's getting overhauled. Most players want this rework it's not just a matter of some few players hate it on ranked, literally any game mode you go to people will go on about nerfing ret removing ret ect. It's hated for a reason. making it weaker but doing the same thing won't remove how boring ret is to play
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby James2 » Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:08 am

I can't recall the last time I saw someone in-game complain about Ret's existence. I've been playing for five years so it's probably happened, but it's not at all common.

I highly suspect that (on this and other issues) people who regularly post on the forum and/or ToS discord aren't representative of the playerbase as a whole.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby PatrykSzczescie » Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:13 am

Question: can taunted by dead players be taunted by living ones in the same phrase?
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:56 am

James2 wrote:I can't recall the last time I saw someone in-game complain about Ret's existence. I've been playing for five years so it's probably happened, but it's not at all common.

I highly suspect that (on this and other issues) people who regularly post on the forum and/or ToS discord aren't representative of the playerbase as a whole.


What modes do you play? I see it a lot in ranked and TT, in general a lot of people hate retri or at least don't like it, it's generally one of those roles you think of when you talk about poorly made roles: Along with framer, spy, Disguiser, forger, Medium (ect. you get the point)
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Spoiler: Town: Jailor
Mafia: Consort
NE: Witch
NB: Guardian Angel
Coven: Necromancer
NC: Pirate
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby James2 » Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:46 am

Soulshade55r wrote:
James2 wrote:I can't recall the last time I saw someone in-game complain about Ret's existence. I've been playing for five years so it's probably happened, but it's not at all common.

I highly suspect that (on this and other issues) people who regularly post on the forum and/or ToS discord aren't representative of the playerbase as a whole.


What modes do you play? I see it a lot in ranked and TT, in general a lot of people hate retri or at least don't like it, it's generally one of those roles you think of when you talk about poorly made roles: Along with framer, spy, Disguiser, forger, Medium (ect. you get the point)


I generally play VIP and TT these days. Though I've previously been a regular in RP and DP, and don't recall much complaining about it.

People in TT complain about ret not being able to be TT. It's not clear people would still object if it could, though in any event TT mode is a special case.

AFAIK there's no major push to remove all the other "poorly made" roles. Nor should there be.
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby Soulshade55r » Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:03 am

James2 wrote:
Soulshade55r wrote:
James2 wrote:I can't recall the last time I saw someone in-game complain about Ret's existence. I've been playing for five years so it's probably happened, but it's not at all common.

I highly suspect that (on this and other issues) people who regularly post on the forum and/or ToS discord aren't representative of the playerbase as a whole.


What modes do you play? I see it a lot in ranked and TT, in general a lot of people hate retri or at least don't like it, it's generally one of those roles you think of when you talk about poorly made roles: Along with framer, spy, Disguiser, forger, Medium (ect. you get the point)


I generally play VIP and TT these days. Though I've previously been a regular in RP and DP, and don't recall much complaining about it.

People in TT complain about ret not being able to be TT. It's not clear people would still object if it could, though in any event TT mode is a special case.

AFAIK there's no major push to remove all the other "poorly made" roles. Nor should there be.


In general no one wants roles like Framer or disguiser ect removed but they want rebalance (Espically framer I think it just needs focused visits and something done about spy to "work")

I really think the retri rework keeps in theme of doing it's job just in a different way, Retri was meant to be someone who would help out once town was lacking in "invest power" or "protective power" ect, they could use their ability to revive townies that were most needed. Now it keeps a similar concept of allowing those abilities in general I'd agree that it's bad to remove roles but I feel like this was the best solution making retri both more fun and balanced, While it is a game full of "PRS" (Adding citizen is horrible and will lead to players leaving). Some roles are better then others and that's just a matter of fact, it will generally stay that way just by nature of the game and every game (Different abilities will always be better then others) but there's a way to make the gap between roles smaller I'm all in.

I don't play much Vip myself (sometimes I prefer TT coven when it's there). Generally I think you're wrong about no major push to "rework" (Not outright remove) roles from the game. Retri has just been gaining traction And more hate over recent times it's always been a badly balanced and unfun role, most people would at least agree.
Favourite Roles (To play)
Spoiler: Town: Jailor
Mafia: Consort
NE: Witch
NB: Guardian Angel
Coven: Necromancer
NC: Pirate
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Re: Details of upcoming patch

Postby TomG2001 » Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:20 am

when is this patch being released?
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