Achilles wrote:Juggernaut will still be more rare than NKs and has the lowest chance of any role to spawn from an ANY slot, but it will be around 6 times more likely to spawn in every slot it is able to spawn in.
Superalex11 wrote:Achilles wrote:Juggernaut will still be more rare than NKs and has the lowest chance of any role to spawn from an ANY slot, but it will be around 6 times more likely to spawn in every slot it is able to spawn in.
So uhhh... are you sure this is correct? I've just checked role frequency over all CAA reports before this patch and this is what I get: https://i.gyazo.com/7c6dc4b269a3462ac10 ... eb2e9c.png
The table shows the count of each role over all CAA reports, functionally representing their spawnrate. Though, since reports don't account for role conversions, these numbers don't accurately reflect spawnrates of all roles, just those that can't convert. But with that in mind we can look at some, including jugg.
The roles I've bolded are unique roles which can't be converted, all of which (except jugg) should have about the same spawnrate. From this table, the average spawnrate of non-jugg bolded roles is about 1.96%. This means that over 100 'any' slots (in CAA), we could expect, for example, about 2 ww's. The spawnrate of jugg, however, seems to be a much lower 0.36%.
The problem then, is that if we're to increase jugg's spawnrate by 6x, it... goes above the others...? Clearly something is wrong here, and as yet I can't see the fault being in my calculations.
Superalex11 wrote:Achilles wrote:Juggernaut will still be more rare than NKs and has the lowest chance of any role to spawn from an ANY slot, but it will be around 6 times more likely to spawn in every slot it is able to spawn in.
So uhhh... are you sure this is correct? I've just checked role frequency over all CAA reports before this patch and this is what I get: https://i.gyazo.com/7c6dc4b269a3462ac10 ... eb2e9c.png
The table shows the count of each role over all CAA reports, functionally representing their spawnrate. Though, since reports don't account for role conversions, these numbers don't accurately reflect spawnrates of all roles, just those that can't convert. But with that in mind we can look at some, including jugg.
The roles I've bolded are unique roles which can't be converted, all of which (except jugg) should have about the same spawnrate. From this table, the average spawnrate of non-jugg bolded roles is about 1.96%. This means that over 100 'any' slots (in CAA), we could expect, for example, about 2 ww's. The spawnrate of jugg, however, seems to be a much lower 0.36%.
The problem then, is that if we're to increase jugg's spawnrate by 6x, it... goes above the others...? Clearly something is wrong here, and as yet I can't see the fault being in my calculations.
Superalex11 wrote:@Kyuss I think you've misunderstood. It's not that jugg spawnrate appears too low compared to those in its category (unique non-convertibles), but that it's too high. And plus, I'm alreading working with error margins of ~3% in some areas here, so even if we're speaking in the opposite direction I don't think sampling bias is a significant problem.
@Scarf I've been thinking about this since you posted, and I'm still not able to reconcile it with the data, or even connect it intuitively. Ww and jugg are both unique non-convertibles, so they should remain in proportion regardless.
Oddly, though, is that the CRP numbers do make a lot more sense. Here I've counted the number of matches which have at least one of each role: https://i.gyazo.com/aa3e082820b811fb936 ... 401ee0.png
Brilliand wrote:The ratio between WW and Jugg spawnrates should depend both on their relative base spawnrates, and on the number of Any, Random Neutral and Neutral Killing slots in the game. The more slots that can spawn either a WW or a Jugg, the more the WW-to-Jugg ratio will skew toward 1:1. Did you compensate for that effect?
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